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Thread: Dual Quad Intake Conversion To Dual 2-BBL Throttle Bodies

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    Quote Originally Posted by 98Dak408 View Post
    As it sits on the base or the plenum?
    IMO sitting on the plenum even if it were cut down is a little too busy. I am guessing you would still have to stack the 2bbl adapters on top of it too?

    I would like the look without the plenum and if they fit the 2bbl adapters cleaned up and sat on top of that.

    Or even better 2 4bbl TBs, but that is probably way to much air.

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    I like the first one. Seems like that would be kinda cool, because it would effectively split the intake system into 1 - 2bbl for 4 cylinders x 2.

    Have you tried putting 2 of the M1 2bbl reducers on each side, instead of the plenum?
    Alan Short
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    Quote Originally Posted by 98Dak408 View Post
    As it sits on the base or the plenum?
    The tb's sitting on the plenum/lid gives a good approach. It also gives enough time/area change ie bigger, to let the air turn to the entries instead of making sharper turns or crashing into whatever little floor it has. What does it look like using the 2/4 adapters, but you would have less plenum area being separate. Throttle response should be better though.
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    IMO sitting on the plenum even if it were cut down is a little too busy. I am guessing you would still have to stack the 2bbl adapters on top of it too?
    I would not use the 2-bbl adapters. I would machine a flat plate for the TB’s to mount to the plenum.

    I would like the look without the plenum and if they fit the 2bbl adapters cleaned up and sat on top of that.
    The 2-bbl adapter could be made to fit nicely. But I would have to use a 1:1 linkage.

    Or even better 2 4bbl TBs, but that is probably way to much air.
    It would look cool but yes I think too much cfm.


    I like the first one. Seems like that would be kinda cool, because it would effectively split the intake system into 1 - 2bbl for 4 cylinders x 2.
    Yes I like that set-up too. I would have to use the 2-bbl adapters to provide room for the injectors and fuel rails. I could also machine an adapter that doesn't neck down at the bottom as the mopar adapters do.

    Have you tried putting 2 of the M1 2bbl reducers on each side, instead of the plenum?
    Yes.
    Last edited by 98Dak408; 11-22-2009 at 09:00 PM.

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    I'm actually leaning toward reducing the plenum height to 2" and using that. I could still use a progressive linkage if I wanted, it would even out the intake pulses, I would probably obtain the best vacuum signal...and I would have ample height for the fuel injectors and fuel rails. It would also be about the height of the M1 2-bbl intake. Or, machine my own adapters for the base of the tunnel manifold.

  6. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by 98Dak408 View Post
    I'm actually leaning toward reducing the plenum height to 2" and using that. I could still use a progressive linkage if I wanted, it would even out the intake pulses, I would probably obtain the best vacuum signal...and I would have ample height for the fuel injectors and fuel rails. It would also be about the height of the M1 2-bbl intake. Or, machine my own adapters for the base of the tunnel manifold.
    What are you going to do for an airhat or are you going to just put round cleaners on the top of each TB? If you could make a nice airhat setup it would be a hell of a ram air setup.

    Todd


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    What are you going to do for an airhat or are you going to just put round cleaners on the top of each TB? If you could make a nice airhat setup it would be a hell of a ram air setup.
    I have been thinking about some type of airhat set-up but so far not too much thought. I have thought about the dual quad air cleaner but I as yet don't know what kind of space I will have toward the firewall. Might be able to tie something into the cowl hood I have too. (Actually same hood as you.)

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    You should look into pressing different throttle cams on the TB shafts, with a 1:1 linkage it's going to be really touchy with the cams they come with. Then again, you're not going to make very much torque either, so it might come out in the wash.

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    You should look into pressing different throttle cams on the TB shafts, with a 1:1 linkage it's going to be really touchy with the cams they come with. Then again, you're not going to make very much torque either, so it might come out in the wash.
    Yes I have to figure something out there. In regard to torque, the engine has plenty now. I'll have to see what happens.

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    Pulled the M1 2-bbl and installed the tunnel ram to check for fitment issues. Looks like I can make it work. A lot of different mods are necessary though. The thermostat water neck is going to be interesting.






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    That water neck looks like it will be a pain and a half. What about using that and making something similar to a TPI mani for it and have 1 large TB on the front of that? I am thinking about doing something like that with mine for forced induction. Just a thought.
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    That water neck looks like it will be a pain and a half. What about using that and making something similar to a TPI mani for it and have 1 large TB on the front of that? I am thinking about doing something like that with mine for forced induction. Just a thought.
    Yeah that's definately a thought. I am trying to do this without the expense of aftermarket TBs, hence the reason for using two OEM TB's. A guy I know did what you are referring to with a Ford engine. I kinda like the look of the old school dual carb thing so I'm going to see what I can do to make it work.

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    that's pretty damn cool. aside from the water neck/ac compressor issue- looks like it would need material added/machined for the intake bolts- and injector bosses. both of which should be pretty easy for a machine shop.

    if that was a complete, marketed, ready to run setup i'd consider buying one. would have to get creative with an air hat for my vortech though. it'd be worth the trouble for something awesome like that!

    pete
    Hey Pete,

    Thanks! I've got a small mill in my garage and plan to do the machining myself. I'm looking for an inexpensive used TIG large enough to handle an intake but even used they are quite a few bucks. I plan to machine it, and if I don't have a welder by then I'll get it welded at a shop. I'm going to cut the plenum down a couple inches too. I have quite a few things to figure out, but all in due time. By using modifed OEM TBs, I can tailor the cfm to what I want and won't have the expense of aftermarket TBs. Of course with deep pockets you could put 4-bbl TBs on it and... The air cleaner or airhat will take little thought but I'll cross that bridge when I come to it. Any suggestions are welcome.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 98Dak408 View Post
    Hey Pete,

    Thanks! I've got a small mill in my garage and plan to do the machining myself. I'm looking for an inexpensive used TIG large enough to handle an intake but even used they are quite a few bucks.
    I have TIG'd on intakes before, so let me give you some advice; use at least a 200 amp machine and make sure you have a water cooled torch. I have a 175 amp and an air cooled torch. All I did was weld a piece back on that broke off and it was all my machine could do to weld it (even pre heated to 325) and even with cutting gloves on, it was all I could do to hold onto the torch.
    Alan Short
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    I have TIG'd on intakes before, so let me give you some advice; use at least a 200 amp machine and make sure you have a water cooled torch. I have a 175 amp and an air cooled torch. All I did was weld a piece back on that broke off and it was all my machine could do to weld it (even pre heated to 325) and even with cutting gloves on, it was all I could do to hold onto the torch.
    Yeah I was thinking a minimum of 250amps and a water cooled torch. The older ones require a big circuit and the new ones are so expensive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 98Dak408 View Post
    Yeah I was thinking a minimum of 250amps and a water cooled torch. The older ones require a big circuit and the new ones are so expensive.
    Mine runs on single phase 440, but all I have is single phase 220. I have a kickup box to convert the power to 440. I've run it that way since 2002 when I got it and it works great.
    My machine is a Lincoln square wave 175. I got it up in Ohio. My uncle knows a guy that buys the equipment in lots, so I got the machine with everything but a gas bottle, for $800.
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    Mine runs on single phase 440, but all I have is single phase 220. I have a kickup box to convert the power to 440. I've run it that way since 2002 when I got it and it works great.
    My machine is a Lincoln square wave 175. I got it up in Ohio. My uncle knows a guy that buys the equipment in lots, so I got the machine with everything but a gas bottle, for $800.
    You got a good deal. This "kick-up box", did you maked it or buy it? Where can you get one?

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    Quote Originally Posted by 98Dak408 View Post
    Yeah that's definately a thought. I am trying to do this without the expense of aftermarket TBs, hence the reason for using two OEM TB's. A guy I know did what you are referring to with a Ford engine. I kinda like the look of the old school dual carb thing so I'm going to see what I can do to make it work.
    Aftermarket TB's are not always that expensive. I have a 90mm TB that I picked up for like 50 bux a while back. Im may not use it on this build however because I think it will be just to big for my turbo goals.. I agree with the classic look of a dual carb setup, but I like that look more on a rat rod style vehicle. You could also keep the end at the ac compressor closed and put your intake inlet on the side of it. Running a CAI or what ever you want to keep the heat away from the air filter. I would think if you dont put the inlet out of the front and come off a side, you may be able to keep the OE water neck setup and AC in place. I wont be running AC on my setup so I have a little more leway, and im going to use a -16 AN weld on bung to a custom bottom plate for the water neck. Then AN fittings to route the upper rad hose over to a Megan Race Rad that is all aluminum and a lot thicker than OEM so im hoping it will cool a bit better too. With a set of 2 12" puller fans I picked up for 30ea (still have same deal available if anyone is interested) I am going to be doing a bit of fabrication with this so it should be fun.
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  19. #44

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    As for the CFM issue, you could use smaller TB's maybe off a V6 or restrict the flow with some air filter/cold air intake tuning. Motorcycles did that for years. Used a air box to limit air flow.

    I would want both TB synchronized though in either application.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 98Dak408 View Post
    You got a good deal. This "kick-up box", did you maked it or buy it? Where can you get one?
    My Uncle scored it for me along with the welder. It's a dedicated piece, designed to multiply the voltage. I'll look and see if it has a manufacturer/model number and I'll also take a picture of it if you like.
    Alan Short
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    My Uncle scored it for me along with the welder. It's a dedicated piece, designed to multiply the voltage. I'll look and see if it has a manufacturer/model number and I'll also take a picture of it if you like.
    Yeah that would be great if you could. Thanks!

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    Picked up some aluminum T6061 .75" and .875" solid round stock in order to fab some bosses for the mounting bolts. I'll try to get this done over the weekend as well as mill holes for the injector bungs.

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    Looks like some work there for ya. Will be nice when you get done I'm sure.
    The Dakota RT is gone... but not forgotten.

    '15 Granite Crystal Metallic SRT 392.

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    Machined the injector bung holes at a 12-degree angle. Also machined relief’s for the manifold bolt bosses. Arrow in last pic shows one boss for mock-up. I will make them longer than necessary, and once welded on, I will machine them down to height and drill the holes. I've also got to make a fixture like the wood blocks to get the injector bungs at the right position so the person welding doesn't have to think about anything but welding. I can't afford a TIG welding machine right now so I'll have to farm the welding out.






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    As usual, nice work. How did you keep the drill from walking with that angle piece where the bolt goes through? Mill a flat, spot drill, then use a drill bit?
    The Dakota RT is gone... but not forgotten.

    '15 Granite Crystal Metallic SRT 392.

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