+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 23 of 23

Thread: Which injectors, and next steps?

  1. #1
    Senior Member

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    426

    Default Which injectors, and next steps?

    Finally got my SS exhaust welded enough to take the truck for a spin.

    m1
    50mm f&b
    hughes 0814al cam
    1.92 ported r/t heads
    1.6 RRs
    95 exhaust manifolds

    truck is a 2000. No idea what the stock injectors are, but I put in what i THINK are 21lb injectors (ive had them 15 years, sitting for 5).

    My tune is obviously way off, but engine sounds good. Whats the next step, should I use stock or the ford (21lb or??) injectors? should I put a wideband o2 in? For SCT how is tuning done? dyno or?

    Sorry for noob question. Last time I installed these parts was 2005 and B&G flashedy pcm.

    thanks guysm

  2. #2

    Default

    Stock injectors at your HP level is fine, as long as they are clean. Are you going to add headers? If your not going to add headers, you have a couple options find a place that is familiar with the Mopar system (SCT or HPTuners) and have them dyno tune it or contact FlyinRyan for a canned tune.

  3. #3


    krs1r/t's Avatar
    want more inchs STROKE IT

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    vineland, nj
    Posts
    5,863

    Default

    Your next step is definitely a tune. Get air/fuel gauge installed so you have data to give the guy tuning.
    www.performanceinjectionequipment.com
    He always did my tuning with Sct and factory pcm

    Bad Luck Truck
    Current setup
    „R„block 429ci W5 heads 700hp N/A
    1/8 mile #'s 6.47@105 1.37 60’ 10.23@131

    Old 1/4 numbers below with 408
    Fastest N/A 2010,2011,2014
    477-RWHP ?-RWTQ

    11.244 ET @ 119.71mph N/A
    FOXHOLE RACING
    "If you like me good, if you hate me, even better!"
    Chris

  4. #4
    niebs's Avatar
    Senior Member

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    North DE
    Posts
    1,761

    Default

    Wideband and a tune for sure.

  5. #5
    Senior Member

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    426

    Default

    thanks guys.

    no headers. ive had them crack, and clearance issues suck. the 95 mnifolds are a healthy 2 1/8" out, so its decent.

    Whats the wideband to get these days? I had an LM-1 but that was ages ago. I also tried to tune some with an SMT-6 but it just didnt work well, is there a way to tune an SCT yourself, starting with a canned tune from someone?

    Thanks

  6. #6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by spawn_x View Post
    thanks guys.

    no headers. ive had them crack, and clearance issues suck. the 95 mnifolds are a healthy 2 1/8" out, so its decent.

    Whats the wideband to get these days? I had an LM-1 but that was ages ago. I also tried to tune some with an SMT-6 but it just didnt work well, is there a way to tune an SCT yourself, starting with a canned tune from someone?

    Thanks
    Funny. I've had the iron manifolds crack before any headers. Depends on the quality of the header.
    I've used the AEM brand wide band. That seems to have the latest requirements for hdmi tuning and it's all built in the gauge itself.
    I wouldn't think you'd start with a "canned" tune because you did put in a more potent cam w M1.
    I have no knowledge of setting up an STC tune other than w an outside acquisition of such.
    I have a bit stronger cam than you in my 2000 cc, heads mildly worked over with the bigger valves, stock injectors w a 52 tb, the Air Gasp mani, Spintec headers, MSD ign, Mopar performance pcm and the truck ran fine w no tune.
    Not saying I'm at peak performance but it's going ok for everyday driving at around 14.3 average afr.

  7. #7
    Senior Member

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    426

    Default

    I forgot all about it, but I need to set the fuel sync first. Ordered the AEM. Will get the fuel sync set and hook up the wideband and see where Im at. I think the stock injectors are in right now (theyre both pink, my old and the ones that came on the truck)

    Thanks bros!

  8. #8
    Junior Member

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    Fairless Hills, Pa.
    Posts
    11

    Default

    If you're still looking to install new injectors, I have a set of Accel 21# injectors that I installed on my 95 V8 Dakota, but they were too much for the OBD1 system to handle, so I put the stock ones back in. The Accel's have less than 50 miles on them, so they are like new. Paid over $300 new from Hughes, will sell them for $200 if you have any interest. I will send pics also.

  9. #9

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by theo View Post
    If you're still looking to install new injectors, I have a set of Accel 21# injectors that I installed on my 95 V8 Dakota, but they were too much for the OBD1 system to handle, so I put the stock ones back in. The Accel's have less than 50 miles on them, so they are like new. Paid over $300 new from Hughes, will sell them for $200 if you have any interest. I will send pics also.
    PM sent

  10. #10
    Senior Member

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    426

    Default

    Got my truck back from Martin Saine (Thanks!) and started to do some test driving.

    I got the AEM installed but not sure whats off, its showing on the lean side at idle like 16-20 but my snap on 2500 showing rich on the o2 sensor. When I pop the throttle real sharp it stumbles, and I see afr on the wideband go over 20 and fall back down.

    At cruise the aem falls down to 14s etc.

    When playing with throttle at low rpms, the snap on gives me p0201/0202/etc momentarily, injector codes. Maybe try injectors?

    Also put a new Denso o2 in.

    Ill reach out to PIE for the tunr

  11. #11


    99dart's Avatar
    Senior Member

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Washington...the hot side!
    Posts
    3,886

    Default

    Are you talking about the O2 sensor for the AEM gauge or factory O2 sensors in exhaust? NTK or Mopar sensors work best in exhaust.
    99 DA CC R/T
    13.97@100 w/modded kegger & ported TB
    12.96 @103
    10:8-1 .30 over forged bottom end
    R/T ported heads
    Detroit locker 4:56 gears
    Built 46RE MSaine 3500 stall Ultra Billet
    http://imgur.com/a/lOVuZ

  12. #12
    Senior Member

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    426

    Default

    Me again.. hey at least the dak is alive still

    Havent done a tune yet, because Im not sure if I should change something. I am kind of unhappy with power under 2000rpm, it just feela deadish. I am beginning to think that its not a good combinatio of parts. Is the m1 too much? Going to a 52mm TB will move the rpm range even more, no? Is it the lack of tune? 3.92 gears currently, stoco stall, looking for a nice DD
    Last edited by spawn_x; 03-04-2023 at 02:19 PM.

  13. #13

    SpoR/T driver

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Lancaster, SC
    Posts
    1,284

    Default

    It's 100% the lack of tune. It doesn't matter what parts you throw on the engine, your PCM is still sending fuel for a 250hp 5.9L. It will not get better without having it properly setup.

    '98 RC/SB - Hellcat/6 Speed Swapped
    10.18@139.8mph
    '00 AF RC R/T Under Construction!
    '01 IB RC R/T Under Construction!
    '99 SY CC R/T Sold
    '00 AF RC R/T Sold
    DRTC Member #1181

  14. #14
    Senior Member

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    426

    Default

    So the tune is in, better than stock, but still not happy below 2000 rpm. I got a new FB 52mm throttle body as well.

    Is the M1 killing the low end? Or the Hughes 0814AL cam moving the powerband too much higher?

    https://www.hughesengines.com/Index/...4&partid=30212

    specs on the cam.

    second question, since I have a trans good to 750hp now, what would it take to get to 600hp these days, reliably, and streetable? Forged bottom end and a blower? Looking for street usable power. I am aware it will involve spending some $$$.

  15. #15

    evilrt's Avatar
    Senior Member

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Flint, MI
    Posts
    309

    Default

    Flow chart put together by FRP.

    Flyin Ryan flow chart.jpg
    Mike Williams
    #001



    98 DA RC GrapeJuice
    99 BLK CC (Buy Back)
    00 BLK RC ProCharged -Hotchkis - on and on (Sold)
    01 AF CC (Leased - Turned in)

  16. #16

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by spawn_x View Post
    So the tune is in, better than stock, but still not happy below 2000 rpm. I got a new FB 52mm throttle body as well.

    Is the M1 killing the low end? Or the Hughes 0814AL cam moving the powerband too much higher?

    https://www.hughesengines.com/Index/...4&partid=30212

    specs on the cam.

    second question, since I have a trans good to 750hp now, what would it take to get to 600hp these days, reliably, and streetable? Forged bottom end and a blower? Looking for street usable power. I am aware it will involve spending some $$$.
    That is the same cam that I am using (but mine is on a 110 LSA), and when I put on the M1 I lost a lot of torque below 3500 rpm and picked up a little bit of power above 3500. The cam is a good cam with the kegger, but not enough duration to make a lot of power from 4500-6000 rpm where the M1 wants to run. Something is wrong if it is not running well below 2000 rpm. Mine runs great from idle to 6000 rpm, just had more low end with the kegger.

  17. #17
    Senior Member

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    426

    Default

    It runs well, just low on grunt in the low RPMs. Feels good up top. Had this setup in my 5.2 and it behaved the same. Did hughes do a custo grind for you? My cam is 20 years old and was on my other truck, but dont think the specs changed from whata on their site today. I installed mine at 0, could possible advnce it a bit.

    Should probably dyno it right about now.

  18. #18

    98Dak408's Avatar
    Supporting Vendor

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Detroit Area, Michigan
    Posts
    2,975

    Default

    It runs well, just low on grunt in the low RPMs.
    Are you sure your tv cable is adjusted properly? I've seen other people complain about that, and the trans wasn't down shifting to the lower gear. Hence, the vehicle was a dog at lower rpm.

  19. #19
    pat d's Avatar
    Senior Member

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Location
    miami fl
    Posts
    138

    Default

    Hey guys just did heads cam lifters have custom grind from comp 1.7 rr FRP tune on HP tunes Ryan got this thing on point but definitely knocked some of the bottom off it stock converter is probably killing some of it also make sure ur trans is shifting right mine is sticking in 3-4 sometimes I bought a trans kit with pressure/governor switch’s and filter but from 2200-5800 she pulls a lot harder now

  20. #20
    Senior Member

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    426

    Default

    was your custom grind specced with 1.6 or 1.7 RRs in mind?

  21. #21

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by spawn_x View Post
    It runs well, just low on grunt in the low RPMs. Feels good up top. Had this setup in my 5.2 and it behaved the same. Did hughes do a custo grind for you? My cam is 20 years old and was on my other truck, but dont think the specs changed from whata on their site today. I installed mine at 0, could possible advnce it a bit.

    Should probably dyno it right about now.
    The Hughes cam was in the truck when I bought it, cam card looks like the off the shelf grind (208 @ .050, 110 LSA). 1.6 Harland Sharp roller rocker on Eddy heads. Hard to beat the low end of a kegger intake.

  22. #22
    pat d's Avatar
    Senior Member

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Location
    miami fl
    Posts
    138

    Default

    It was base of 1.6 but had specs for both I had 1.7s on the truck already with stock cam and heads air gap fi intake headers and a can tune she would burn the tires down with a little power braking had to leave the line from idle now I noticed a difference after upgrading less bottom but mid to top end is a lot better but 58-5900 it drops off

  23. #23

    KicknAsphlt's Avatar
    Senior Member

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Denver, CO
    Posts
    1,834

    Default

    You never specified which M1 -- 2bbl or 4bbl. A 2bbl M1 loses little low end compared to a kegger, but a 4bbl is like taking the wind out of your sails. Couple that with your ported heads, and that's probably why you don't have any bottom end. Porting heads is meant for top-end performance because you're hogging out the runners for more air flow at higher rpms. When you have low rpms, the larger runners are too large to keep up the air velocity to make power. That's also why the 4bbl kills your bottom end as well - larger plenum (and runners?) kills the velocity.
    - Justin


    '00 BW CC R/T
    '91 Graphite Turbo Targa Supra

    F-Quick Myspace Facebook

+ Reply to Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may post new threads
  • You may post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •