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Thread: New Product - MSP 746 auto

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    Default New Product - MSP 746 auto

    If there is one question I am most often asked by serious enthusiasts, it's this; 727 swap or built 46RE?
    Those who have made the 727 swap will enthusiastically testify they put a lot more power to the ground, significantly lower ET, and increase trap speeds. We all know the downside, loss of OD and TCC lock-up. It's quite a decision whether or not to do the swap. How important is street driving, how important is track performance?
    Similarly, many of my 727 customers would like to install an OD trans, but don't want to give up the performance of their 727's.

    Some time ago I decided to do something about this question. I've been working on a solution and am close to releasing a game changing product that will solve the dilema of "To 727 or not to 727"?

    Because this forum has been a key supporter of my business for many years I would like to post an early reveal of my new product and get some feedback from you guys to guage interest in this new product.

    My solution to this problem is the new MSP 746. The 746 is a 3 speed conversion for the 46RE that is performed entirely within a factory OD housing. In essence this gives you a 727 transmission in a 46RE housing, maintaining all external dimensions and eliminating the need for special cross members, driveshaft modifications, different flex plates, or converters.
    The key benefit is that since the conversion takes place in the OD housing, it is convertible! The user will be able to switch back and forth between 3 speed and 4 speed in under 2 hours!

    Street guys will be able to keep their OD for street use with the ability to quickly convert to 746 track mode for those special occasions.
    Track guys will be able to keep their trucks set for killer track performance with the ability to quickly convert back to OD mode for the occasional road trip.

    While in 46 mode all factory parameters are maintained. Full converter lock-up and electronic controls are retained.
    When in 746 mode there will be significant ET reduction due to reduced static weight, reduced rotational mass, and reduced parasitic loss.

    In addition, in 746 mode we will be able to use all 727 valvebody configurations. This will allow for Manual, Reverse Manual, TransBrake, and Safe Neutral valvebodies.
    We will also be able to use RE valvebodies and even retain the TCC lock-up in three speed mode if desired!

    Initial offerings will be for RE configuration with RH and 4x4 configurations to follow.

    I will be able to offer this conversion as a stand alone product or as an option to my 46RE transmission package.

    I expect to have track results from beta units in the next couple months and will post results.


    Again, this is an early release notification. Please post questions, comments, interest, whatever!

    So talk to me guys...

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    Osee's Avatar
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    Sounds awesome Martin! Keeping tabs on this.


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    That sounds awesome! What's involved in converting between modes?

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    Can't wait to see how it goes! Sounds like a great option
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    Initial setup up will involve setting intermediate shaft depth. I am working on tooling to send with stand alone units for quick and accurate setup. After that it is simply removing tailhousing and bolting in the 746 tail housing.
    If you were to take advantage of valve body options, that could be swapped at the same time.

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    Just in time for the 408 depending on cost.

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  7. #7

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    Awesome product Martin! I know we've talked in the past, but what I'd like is a bullet proof 46RE good for 1000whp. It might seem like a waste of time and money, but I want drivability and strip performace.
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    How much work would be involved to convert my MSP 46RE to a 746?
    12.10@106@Famoso Raceway

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    cool i have my own 46re 3speed conversion still on transmissionstand in my shop , i´m not the onlyone having this ides.
    would be fun follow beta testing
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoFastGray View Post
    How much work would be involved to convert my MSP 46RE to a 746?
    The first time would be a few hours to set end play, but after that you can swap back and forth in a couple hours or less.

    email me and we'll talk...

  11. #11

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    Definitely interested, was going to contact you about a 727 here shortly anyway, your just up the freeway from me. Keep us posted on testing

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    Quote Originally Posted by Parasite View Post
    Definitely interested, was going to contact you about a 727 here shortly anyway, your just up the freeway from me. Keep us posted on testing
    Will do!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lonesoldier79 View Post
    Awesome product Martin! I know we've talked in the past, but what I'd like is a bullet proof 46RE good for 1000whp. It might seem like a waste of time and money, but I want drivability and strip performace.
    It shouldn't be hard to do with money. Aren't the 46RE, 47RE, and 48RE all in the same housing with different internals? If a 48RE can be built to handle a hopped up Cummins pushing 1800 ft lbs of torque, then I don't see any reason why the 46RE couldn't handle 1000 hp with similar parts.
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    Martin, sounds intriguing!

    Any advancements recently in automatic OD transmissions for use behind mopar big blocks? could the OD unit from a 46RE or RH be modified and attached to a 727 to make it a 4-spd OD auto? I'm aware of gear vendors but not convinced that's the route I would want to go, and I'm also not convinced that I want adapter bells/plates to make a small block 518/46RH work behind a big block
    --Tom
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    Quote Originally Posted by Filthy Filbert View Post
    Martin, sounds intriguing!

    Any advancements recently in automatic OD transmissions for use behind mopar big blocks? could the OD unit from a 46RE or RH be modified and attached to a 727 to make it a 4-spd OD auto? I'm aware of gear vendors but not convinced that's the route I would want to go, and I'm also not convinced that I want adapter bells/plates to make a small block 518/46RH work behind a big block
    There has been parts advancements to safely hold power. Cases are strong, just need the good parts designed for the expected power.

    JW Ultra Bell has been proven durable in either 727 or 518, allows small block 518 to adapt to B or RB blocks.
    727/GV is also a favorite, but GV have weak reverse and are spendy.

    OD unit will not fit on 727 case. Different bolt patterns, shaft configuration, rear support.
    Last edited by Saineperf; 06-28-2016 at 04:22 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Filthy Filbert View Post
    It shouldn't be hard to do with money. Aren't the 46RE, 47RE, and 48RE all in the same housing with different internals? If a 48RE can be built to handle a hopped up Cummins pushing 1800 ft lbs of torque, then I don't see any reason why the 46RE couldn't handle 1000 hp with similar parts.
    You are correct. We can build 46 series Trans to hold in excess of 1000 hp, just takes the right parts. With the 746 we will be reducing the load on internals by eliminating the OD planet set, and should be able to increase the capacity.

    As I've said before, give me a realistic goal and vehicle info and I'll advise feasibility and cost.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Saineperf View Post
    You are correct. We can build 46 series Trans to hold in excess of 1000 hp, just takes the right parts. With the 746 we will be reducing the load on internals by eliminating the OD planet set, and should be able to increase the capacity.

    As I've said before, give me a realistic goal and vehicle info and I'll advise feasibility and cost.
    1200 hp build would look like this (custom built for vehicle and powerplant)
    Ultra Billet converter
    Blueprinted pump
    5 clutch Forward pack
    7 clutch Billet Direct Drum
    Billet input shafts
    Billet intermediate shaft
    Rigid front band
    Custom servos
    Constant Pressure vb
    Steel planets
    Straight OD planets
    MagHytec pan (strengthens case)
    Custom machining for lube, pressure, and durability
    Blueprinted assembly clearances for performance and reliability
    And many support parts not mentioned, matched for compatibility

    The key, just like building an engine, is selecting and designing parts that work together as an integrated system without adding unnecessary weight, which robs performance.

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    I spoke with a customer a couple of weeks ago who told me you had this in the works and he was considering it. Sounds pretty cool and I look forward to seeing the finished product.

    Constant Pressure vb
    If you don’t mind me asking Martin, what do you mean by a “Constant Pressure vb? Does that allow the PCM/Electric Governor to better cope with higher line pressure without erratic shifting and/or no-shift problems at WOT for instance? Does it help balance the 1-2 and 2-3 shift rpm, for example, say at 6000 rpm, so they both occur as close as possible to 6000 rpm if that is where you want it to shift? If I am barking up the wrong tree, what are the benefits of the constant pressure valve body?

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    Quote Originally Posted by 98Dak408 View Post
    I spoke with a customer a couple of weeks ago who told me you had this in the works and he was considering it. Sounds pretty cool and I look forward to seeing the finished product.



    If you don’t mind me asking Martin, what do you mean by a “Constant Pressure vb? Does that allow the PCM/Electric Governor to better cope with higher line pressure without erratic shifting and/or no-shift problems at WOT for instance? Does it help balance the 1-2 and 2-3 shift rpm, for example, say at 6000 rpm, so they both occur as close as possible to 6000 rpm if that is where you want it to shift? If I am barking up the wrong tree, what are the benefits of the constant pressure valve body?
    So much for "keep this quiet" lol!

    CP vb- Apply pressures rise and fall according to throttle input via the TV cable. With positive displacement blowers and turbos it is possible to make big power at mid throttle where apply pressure is low,
    Manual vbs solve this by making full pressure at all times and use no TV circuit.
    CP valvebodies go one step further and retain the TV circuit for shift timing only. Full pressure is maintained auto shifting is enabled.

    CP vb is not for track cars as they don't do part throttle.

  20. #20

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    I'm guessing ECM tuning between the tranny swaps would be a must... No solenoids in the 727 vs some in the 746...
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    How much is a CP valve body? And can I run one on my truck?

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    Quote Originally Posted by KyleDedrick View Post
    I'm guessing ECM tuning between the tranny swaps would be a must... No solenoids in the 727 vs some in the 746...
    You can run the 746 with no pcm changes. Design will prevent OD piston from accidentally applying.
    1-2 and 2-3 shifts will be pcm controlled.
    If OD button is off, pcm will not know any different.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Friggin' R/T View Post
    How much is a CP valve body? And can I run one on my truck?
    CP vb is $475. Can be built for both RH and RESORTS.
    Yes, you can run one in your truck.

  24. #24




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    This is pretty friggen cool, look forward to see the outcome of this new 746
    This signature has been deleted thanks to photobucket!

  25. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by Saineperf View Post
    CP vb is $475. Can be built for both RH and RESORTS.
    Yes, you can run one in your truck.
    Does this include the 3rd gear bog delete and or new solenoids? And will it cause codes? I may order one of those from you if it bolts right up

    2002 Flame Red RC R/T
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    218/226 Comp Cam, Stage 1 Ported EQ Heads, PRW 1.6 Roller Rockers, PIE Custom Tune, Full spintech exhaust with 3" side exit, 52mm Holley, Ported Kegger, Viper E-Fan, Powerdemon Trans, Hotchkis Springs, Leafs and Sway Bars, R/T 20's, Gen 3 viper seats, Custom "Rejected" State Inspection Sticker
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