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View Full Version : Using a wideband o2 for PCM operation?



PeteRT
10-27-2009, 02:27 AM
I have to get a wideband and I'm going toward the innovate products... Reading through their instructions, I found it's possible to replace one of the factory narrow band o2's with a wideband and have it simulate narrowband operation for the PCM...

Anyone done this? Here's a copy paste out of the manual:

10.1. Connecting the LM-1 to simulate a narrow band oxygen
sensor.

It is possible to install the wide-band sensor in place of the OEM oxygen sensor. In this case the meter's analog output signal will replace the OEM oxygen sensor's signal to the fuel injection computer. EFI equipped cars typically incorporate a narrow band oxygen sensor. These sensors are typically 1, 2, 3 or 4 wire sensors.

The analog output connector of the LM-1 can simulate the operation of a narrow band sensor while the wide-band oxygen sensor is installed in place of the OEM narrow-band sensor. Factory equipped Analog output 1 of the LM-1 is programmed to simulate a narrow band sensor. Some
vehicles are equipped with oxygen sensors that do not produce an output voltage but change their resistance depending on exhaust gas content. These sensors cannot be simulated. They are used in less than 1% of all vehicles. Refer to your vehicles specifications if you think that your vehicle may be in this category. The same is true for vehicles already factory equipped with
a wide-band oxygen sensor. These cannot be simulated either.

Some EFI-computers will create a fault when the heater power wires of the oxygen sensor are disconnected. In this case mount the old oxygen sensor in a safe place (but not necessarily in the exhaust) and connect the heater wires to it to keep the EFI-computer happy.

To connect the LM-1 to the EFI-computer, first determine what kind of narrow band sensor is used, then follow the instructions below (you will need a digital multimeter to determine correct OEM sensor wires):

a. Vehicle has a 1-wire sensor:
Wire analog output 1 directly to the wire.

b. Vehicle has a 2-wire sensor:
While the engine is off determine which of the 2 wires has a low resistance between the wire and the sensor body. This is the heater power for the sensor. Wire analog output 1 directly to the other wire. Leave the heater power wire unconnected but make sure it cannot ground itself or see
above.

c. Vehicle has a 3-wire sensor:
Typically the 3 wires are: heater power, Ground, and sensor element connection. Generally they have 1 black wire and 2 white wires. Connect the black wire from the EFI computer to analog output 1 of the meter. Leave the other wires unconnected but make sure they cannot contact any metal parts or see above. If the wiring colors are different, then heater power
can simply be determined by measuring the voltage on the wires when the engine is running. The wire showing 12V or more is the heater power. The sensor element connection voltage fluctuates around 0.45V when the car is warmed up. Wire analog output 1 directly to this wire. The Ground
connection has low resistance to chassis ground (less than 1 Ohm). Measure while the engine is off.

d. Vehicle has a 4-wire sensor
Typically the 4 wires are: heater power, heater ground, sensor ground, and sensor element connection. Proceed as for the 3-wire sensor.

PeteRT
10-27-2009, 02:29 AM
with my true duals, i have the post cat o2 simmed, and the precat o2 in the x-pipe without problems. if this could work, it would be awesome to pull that precat o2 out and replace it with a wideband.... (truck is a 99)

thoughts?

emwhiteR/T
10-27-2009, 04:52 PM
I see where you are going but what would be the point though? All I see is it saves you from adding another bung and shortening the life on your wideband O2. Which you can buy a VW one from a local store without having to pay inflation on the one from Innovate.

What would be nice is if the LM1 could control what the PCM sees in order to adjust the fuel trims to get the optimal AF ratio without swapping tunes. Kind of like an adaptively learning wideband on a standalone, I guess.

hskr
10-27-2009, 09:39 PM
Seems cool, and being able to put it in the x-pipe where your factory one is now will help with the a/f readings of the wideband instead of having it in just one bank. Try it out and see what happens. The wrste that I can see happening is you will pop a CEL for O2 and will just have to get a second bung welded in your exhasut for the wideband somewhere.

PeteRT
10-27-2009, 11:59 PM
that's basically it.. because i don't feel like pulling my exhaust out and welding another bung in the X.... lol.... would probably take me 2 weeks start to finish.
pete

emwhiteR/T
10-28-2009, 02:12 AM
that's basically it.. because i don't feel like pulling my exhaust out and welding another bung in the X.... lol.... would probably take me 2 weeks start to finish.
pete

Fair enough.

PeteRT
10-28-2009, 03:16 AM
if only i had the foresight to put in an extra bung in last year when i did the exhaust......... :noob: serves me right i guess...
pete

emwhiteR/T
10-28-2009, 01:39 PM
if only i had the foresight to put in an extra bung in last year when i did the exhaust......... :noob: serves me right i guess...
pete

It's all good. Innovate sells an extensions chord and a clamp. Then you can stick the O2 sensor in the end of the tailpipe. :nana:

grapejuice1998
10-28-2009, 01:57 PM
if only i had the foresight to put in an extra bung in last year when i did the exhaust......... :noob: serves me right i guess...
pete

If you welded your own exhaust, you could install an 02 bung in about 30 minutes. Just pick an easy to get to location on the side of the pipe (not below), then hole saw the pipe to the size of the bung, then tack weld it, then finish it. No big deal.

PeteRT
10-28-2009, 11:10 PM
If you welded your own exhaust, you could install an 02 bung in about 30 minutes. Just pick an easy to get to location on the side of the pipe (not below), then hole saw the pipe to the size of the bung, then tack weld it, then finish it. No big deal.

ya, i can do it myself, but i'm a horrible welder & will probably end up coming out anyway. i think if i drop the driveshaft i should have enough room to give it a good attempt.. the biggest PITA is the non-auto darkening helmet i have, lol.. ill have to borrow a good one.
pete

krs1r/t
10-29-2009, 12:06 AM
take it to a exaust shop how much could it cost to weld in a bung for you

bfranzel
10-29-2009, 01:28 AM
take it to a exaust shop how much could it cost to weld in a bung for you

i just had 2 put in 3 weeks ago. cost me $35.

PeteRT
10-29-2009, 04:21 AM
where's the fun in having it done? lol
pete

bfranzel
10-29-2009, 05:51 AM
also when you buy the lm2 it comes with the bungs.

PeteRT
10-29-2009, 04:37 PM
just ordered up the lm-2...... hopefully it'll be here saturday & i'll get her done this weekend.
pete

X_HAWAII RT
10-30-2009, 05:11 AM
just ordered up the lm-2...... hopefully it'll be here saturday & i'll get her done this weekend.
pete

I don't see why it wouldn't. I ordered mine yesterday, schedule to arrive tomorrow....

grapejuice1998
10-30-2009, 02:21 PM
ya, i can do it myself, but i'm a horrible welder & will probably end up coming out anyway. i think if i drop the driveshaft i should have enough room to give it a good attempt.. the biggest PITA is the non-auto darkening helmet i have, lol.. ill have to borrow a good one.
pete

You can just hold it in front of you like a shield. That's what I would do. :biggthumpup:

hskr
10-30-2009, 02:35 PM
Or do like most guys I see in exhaust shops. Either don't use a sheild at all and just turn thier heads, or use a pair of dark sunglasses.

And no, that wasn't meant to be serious.

grapejuice1998
10-30-2009, 04:25 PM
As long as you're looking through a #11 or darker shade, holding it between you and the work is perfectly acceptable.

Intense RT
10-31-2009, 05:09 AM
I haven't gotten around to getting an auto dark shade either. Been wanting one and would make things so much easier and better looking welds for me, at least. Need to get one of those cheapies, maybe, from northern tool store.

PeteRT
10-31-2009, 05:26 AM
it's hard enough for the inexperienced to weld on the ground or bench... let alone under a truck on jackstands, lol. id like to buy one, but for the one or two weekend jobs per year.... ill just borrow one for a few beers.
pete