Dual Quad Intake Conversion To Dual 2-BBL Throttle Bodies

[98Dak408]

I think I am going to try to convert an old low rise Chrysler 273 Offenhauser dual quad intake manifold to fit my Magnum and run two 2-bbl throttle bodies on it. I plan to modify two OEM 50mm TBs which should provide an inexpensive way to substantially increase the cfm for the engine without buying a 4-bbl TB or 58mm TB. The manifold may also provide more even flow to each intake port. I have the OEM TB off my 360 and can pick up another one from a junkyard on the cheap. I will weld in injector bungs and convert to the vertical bolt pattern necessary for the Magnum head. I'll have to figure out the cooling hose location from the LA style to the Magnum. I will try to hook the accelerator and cruise control cable to the front TB along with the MAP sensor. I will also try to hook up the TV cable to the back TB along with the IAC motor and TPS sensor. I may try to use the conversion adapters for a 4-bbl to 2-bbl or make some type of attaching plate.

I am all ears to pros and cons including ideas for this set up.

I just purchased this used and unmodified intake to play with.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/dualquad.jpg

[ddrango]

Sweet idea...I thought about that old 6 barrel manis in the past, with three TBs, except the TBs need to be cut in length so they all fit, but that dual setup sounds sweet. How much did that manifold go for?

Thing is, you're going to need to cut the 4-bbl holes in each part for the air to flow correctly.

[98Dak408]

Sweet idea...I thought about that old 6 barrel manis in the past, with three TBs, except the TBs need to be cut in length so they all fit, but that dual setup sounds sweet. How much did that manifold go for?

Thing is, you're going to need to cut the 4-bbl holes in each part for the air to flow correctly.I also considered the six pack set-up but as you mentioned, cutting up the OEM TBs might be tricky if not impossible. You would probably want a progressive linkage on that as well.

The intake was $200 shipped. I'm picking up a small mill in the next little while and I can cut the centers out with that.

[Special Ed's R/T - Yaaaay]

I also considered the six pack set-up but as you mentioned, cutting up the OEM TBs might be tricky if not impossible. You would probably want a progressive linkage on that as well.

The intake was $200 shipped. I'm picking up a small mill in the next little while and I can cut the centers out with that.


You guys know that F&B makes a six pack manifold & TBs for our engines, right ?

[grapejuice1998]

That and F&B already makes a bolt-on 6 pack setup. You can even choose how much the 3 t/b's will flow in total.

http://www.fbthrottlebodies.com/

On the 2-4's thing, it just wouldn't be the same without actual 4bbl t/b's. It would looked cobbled together with the 2-4bbl adapter plates.

That's just my opinion though.

[grapejuice1998]

Jinx! :biggthumpup:

[98Dak408]

You guys know that F&B makes a six pack manifold & TBs for our engines, right ?

That and F&B already makes a bolt-on 6 pack setup. You can even choose how much the 3 t/b's will flow in total.Yeah. The price isn't within my budget at the moment.

[98Dak408]

On the 2-4's thing, it just wouldn't be the same without actual 4bbl t/b's. It would looked cobbled together with the 2-4bbl adapter plates.

That's just my opinion though.With a welder and mill I'm hoping to do it without looking too backyard. Can't look any worse than the 4-bbl M1 with the adapter. I'm also looking into a possible mounting plate like F&B fabricated for their six pack configuration. I'm not really into the bling anyway. I just want form and function.

Jinx! :biggthumpup::jester:

[Intense RT]

From what I can tell, you're a good fabricator and I'm curious what you can do with it. You seem picky enough for it to not look bad so keep us posted man.:goodluck:

I think on something like that, I'd try to put th inj bungs an inch or so further up the short runners. May help with more topend hp.

[ddrango]

Yea agreed, found out the price and I said forget it. He has me intrigued with what he plans to do now.

[98Dak408]

I think on something like that, I'd try to put th inj bungs an inch or so further up the short runners. May help with more topend hp.Thanks for the input. I'll keep that in mind. Injector placement is definately a concern.

[Intense RT]

Thanks for the input. I'll keep that in mind. Injector placement is definately a concern.
Only reason I say is I've read some testing on it helping AND you have the opportunity to put it where you want it, to and extent. The runners are short..

[Intense RT]

Looking at the pic again, due to reversion possibilty, I wouldn't full on port match the runners to the heads. I'd leave at least a 1/16 step smaller going into the runner, again, being so short. Don't want fuel and exhaust gases accumulating in the plenums.

[98Dak408]

Looking at the pic again, due to reversion possibilty, I wouldn't full on port match the runners to the heads. I'd leave at least a 1/16 step smaller going into the runner, again, being so short. Don't want fuel and exhaust gases accumulating in the plenums. When I port intakes, I'm a little smaller on the intake port than the head intake port anyway.

[Intense RT]

When I port intakes, I'm a little smaller on the intake port than the head intake port anyway. You got it.:biggthumpup: I was taught, if there's a mismatch, miss it small. Dont want to see the heads flange. That hurts flow more. Best is a perfect match, but given the case, I'd try that first.

[98Dak408]

You got it. I was taught, if there's a mismatch, miss it small. Dont want to see the heads flange. That hurts flow more. Best is a perfect match, but given the case, I'd try that first.Exactly! Otherwise you can turn the desired laminar flow into undesirable turbulent flow which is not a good thing.

[98Dak408]

I have been giving further thought to the low rise Offenhauser intake. A few things concern me: 1) The intake port runners are almost too small for me to port to the size of my ported Edelbrock heads. 2) In order for the throttle body to clear the fuel rails I'd have to use the 1" spacer as well as the 2-BBL to 4-BBL conversion adapter. It may be okay but it seems like a long run and then a somewhat sharp 90-degree angle into the port runners. (But there is a plenum at the bottom and it may be okay.)

I started thinking about using a modified tunnel ram intake instead. It has a nice flowing straight shot into the head ports. There is plenty of room for the injectors. I can make my own adapter plate to the height necessary for hood clearance and can incorporate a plenum for low speed idle quality and MAP signal.

There was a Weiand dual quad tunnel ram for a 340-360 on ebay that was painted orange (with peeling paint) that bid up to $280 plus $20 shipping so let it go before going that high. This morning I found the same intake in great shape (unpainted and unmolested) for $140 locally, so I snapped it up.

Whichever intake I decide to use I'll sell the other one. I'm really leaning toward the tunnel ram though.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/PB040001.jpg

[ddrango]

I see another product on your site in the future...lol

I still need/want an x-brace set from you. I need to win lotto or something because the money tree died...

[98Dak408]

I see another product on your site in the future...lolHey if it works well and can be made without too much expense I just might. :D The nice thing is you can get the extra CFM without an expensive throttle body. You could also use a modified OEM 48mm or 50mm TB.

I still need/want an x-brace set from you. I need to win lotto or something because the money tree died...I'm thinking of offerring a limited time deeper discount on the x-braces soon and even a group buy price.

[blk00rt]

Richard,
When I layed my la style intake up again the magnum heads I had, there was about an 1/8" of a gap all the way around. The intake fit fine on my LA motor but the heads but not on the Mag motor. Maybe my parts were on the outer side of tollerances but the Mag intakes fit fine. I also tried this with a crosswinds manifold (dual pattern) the Mag bolted up fine and the LA leaked because it would not sit all the way down. You might want to check your manifolds with gaskets in place to see if you see the same thing I did.

[ddrango]

Hey if it works well and can be made without too much expense I just might. :D The nice thing is you can get the extra CFM without an expensive throttle body. You could also use a modified OEM 48mm or 50mm TB.

I'm thinking of offerring a limited time deeper discount on the x-braces soon and even a group buy price.

Thanks for considering it! I know I bitch a lot about money but I'm sure you know as well as everyone else knows what it's like to not be able to afford any goodies.

[98Dak408]

Richard,
When I layed my la style intake up again the magnum heads I had, there was about an 1/8" of a gap all the way around. The intake fit fine on my LA motor but the heads but not on the Mag motor. Maybe my parts were on the outer side of tollerances but the Mag intakes fit fine. I also tried this with a crosswinds manifold (dual pattern) the Mag bolted up fine and the LA leaked because it would not sit all the way down. You might want to check your manifolds with gaskets in place to see if you see the same thing I did.
I'll do some mock-up for the LA intake. It has been my understanding that the Magnum manifold will fit on an A engine and vise-versa. The difference is the verticle bolt holes for the Magnum and the angled holes for the A engine. Nonetheless, I'll be careful to check that the fit is proper. Thanks for sharing your experenices Rob.

[98Dak408]

Contemplating the set-up a little more.

This shows the TB on top of the base of the manifold. In this situation it would have to be a direct one-to-one linkage because there is no plenum.
http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/PB150002.jpg


This pic shows the TBs atop the plenum which I would intend to cut down so it isn’t so high.
http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/PB150003.jpg

[Intense RT]

Contemplating the set-up a little more.

This shows the TB on top of the base of the manifold. In this situation it would have to be a direct one-to-one linkage because there is no plenum.
http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/PB150002.jpg


This pic shows the TBs atop the plenum which I would intend to cut down so it isn’t so high.
http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/PB150003.jpgI wouldn't want to take too much. The entry have a good approach to the runners like it sits.

[98Dak408]

I wouldn't want to take too much. The entry have a good approach to the runners like it sits.As it sits on the base or the plenum?

[jmaack727]

As it sits on the base or the plenum?

IMO sitting on the plenum even if it were cut down is a little too busy. I am guessing you would still have to stack the 2bbl adapters on top of it too?

I would like the look without the plenum and if they fit the 2bbl adapters cleaned up and sat on top of that.

Or even better 2 4bbl TBs, but that is probably way to much air.

[grapejuice1998]

I like the first one. Seems like that would be kinda cool, because it would effectively split the intake system into 1 - 2bbl for 4 cylinders x 2.

Have you tried putting 2 of the M1 2bbl reducers on each side, instead of the plenum?

[Intense RT]

As it sits on the base or the plenum?The tb's sitting on the plenum/lid gives a good approach. It also gives enough time/area change ie bigger, to let the air turn to the entries instead of making sharper turns or crashing into whatever little floor it has. What does it look like using the 2/4 adapters, but you would have less plenum area being separate. Throttle response should be better though.

[98Dak408]

IMO sitting on the plenum even if it were cut down is a little too busy. I am guessing you would still have to stack the 2bbl adapters on top of it too?
I would not use the 2-bbl adapters. I would machine a flat plate for the TB’s to mount to the plenum.

I would like the look without the plenum and if they fit the 2bbl adapters cleaned up and sat on top of that.The 2-bbl adapter could be made to fit nicely. But I would have to use a 1:1 linkage.

Or even better 2 4bbl TBs, but that is probably way to much air.It would look cool but yes I think too much cfm.


I like the first one. Seems like that would be kinda cool, because it would effectively split the intake system into 1 - 2bbl for 4 cylinders x 2.Yes I like that set-up too. I would have to use the 2-bbl adapters to provide room for the injectors and fuel rails. I could also machine an adapter that doesn't neck down at the bottom as the mopar adapters do.

Have you tried putting 2 of the M1 2bbl reducers on each side, instead of the plenum?Yes. http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/PB070019.jpg

[98Dak408]

I'm actually leaning toward reducing the plenum height to 2" and using that. I could still use a progressive linkage if I wanted, it would even out the intake pulses, I would probably obtain the best vacuum signal...and I would have ample height for the fuel injectors and fuel rails. It would also be about the height of the M1 2-bbl intake. Or, machine my own adapters for the base of the tunnel manifold.

[WhiteRT]

I'm actually leaning toward reducing the plenum height to 2" and using that. I could still use a progressive linkage if I wanted, it would even out the intake pulses, I would probably obtain the best vacuum signal...and I would have ample height for the fuel injectors and fuel rails. It would also be about the height of the M1 2-bbl intake. Or, machine my own adapters for the base of the tunnel manifold.

What are you going to do for an airhat or are you going to just put round cleaners on the top of each TB? If you could make a nice airhat setup it would be a hell of a ram air setup.

Todd

[98Dak408]

What are you going to do for an airhat or are you going to just put round cleaners on the top of each TB? If you could make a nice airhat setup it would be a hell of a ram air setup.I have been thinking about some type of airhat set-up but so far not too much thought. I have thought about the dual quad air cleaner but I as yet don't know what kind of space I will have toward the firewall. Might be able to tie something into the cowl hood I have too. (Actually same hood as you.)

[Five9Dak]

You should look into pressing different throttle cams on the TB shafts, with a 1:1 linkage it's going to be really touchy with the cams they come with. Then again, you're not going to make very much torque either, so it might come out in the wash.

[98Dak408]

You should look into pressing different throttle cams on the TB shafts, with a 1:1 linkage it's going to be really touchy with the cams they come with. Then again, you're not going to make very much torque either, so it might come out in the wash.Yes I have to figure something out there. In regard to torque, the engine has plenty now. I'll have to see what happens.

[98Dak408]

Pulled the M1 2-bbl and installed the tunnel ram to check for fitment issues. Looks like I can make it work. A lot of different mods are necessary though. The thermostat water neck is going to be interesting.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P2160013.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P2160016.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P2160019.jpg

[RawR/T]

That water neck looks like it will be a pain and a half. What about using that and making something similar to a TPI mani for it and have 1 large TB on the front of that? I am thinking about doing something like that with mine for forced induction. Just a thought.

[98Dak408]

That water neck looks like it will be a pain and a half. What about using that and making something similar to a TPI mani for it and have 1 large TB on the front of that? I am thinking about doing something like that with mine for forced induction. Just a thought.Yeah that's definately a thought. I am trying to do this without the expense of aftermarket TBs, hence the reason for using two OEM TB's. A guy I know did what you are referring to with a Ford engine. I kinda like the look of the old school dual carb thing so I'm going to see what I can do to make it work.

[98Dak408]

that's pretty damn cool. aside from the water neck/ac compressor issue- looks like it would need material added/machined for the intake bolts- and injector bosses. both of which should be pretty easy for a machine shop.

if that was a complete, marketed, ready to run setup i'd consider buying one. would have to get creative with an air hat for my vortech though. it'd be worth the trouble for something awesome like that!

pete
Hey Pete,

Thanks! I've got a small mill in my garage and plan to do the machining myself. I'm looking for an inexpensive used TIG large enough to handle an intake but even used they are quite a few bucks. I plan to machine it, and if I don't have a welder by then I'll get it welded at a shop. I'm going to cut the plenum down a couple inches too. I have quite a few things to figure out, but all in due time. By using modifed OEM TBs, I can tailor the cfm to what I want and won't have the expense of aftermarket TBs. Of course with deep pockets you could put 4-bbl TBs on it and... The air cleaner or airhat will take little thought but I'll cross that bridge when I come to it. Any suggestions are welcome.

[grapejuice1998]

Hey Pete,

Thanks! I've got a small mill in my garage and plan to do the machining myself. I'm looking for an inexpensive used TIG large enough to handle an intake but even used they are quite a few bucks.

I have TIG'd on intakes before, so let me give you some advice; use at least a 200 amp machine and make sure you have a water cooled torch. I have a 175 amp and an air cooled torch. All I did was weld a piece back on that broke off and it was all my machine could do to weld it (even pre heated to 325) and even with cutting gloves on, it was all I could do to hold onto the torch.

[98Dak408]

I have TIG'd on intakes before, so let me give you some advice; use at least a 200 amp machine and make sure you have a water cooled torch. I have a 175 amp and an air cooled torch. All I did was weld a piece back on that broke off and it was all my machine could do to weld it (even pre heated to 325) and even with cutting gloves on, it was all I could do to hold onto the torch.Yeah I was thinking a minimum of 250amps and a water cooled torch. The older ones require a big circuit and the new ones are so expensive.

[grapejuice1998]

Yeah I was thinking a minimum of 250amps and a water cooled torch. The older ones require a big circuit and the new ones are so expensive.

Mine runs on single phase 440, but all I have is single phase 220. I have a kickup box to convert the power to 440. I've run it that way since 2002 when I got it and it works great.
My machine is a Lincoln square wave 175. I got it up in Ohio. My uncle knows a guy that buys the equipment in lots, so I got the machine with everything but a gas bottle, for $800.

[98Dak408]

Mine runs on single phase 440, but all I have is single phase 220. I have a kickup box to convert the power to 440. I've run it that way since 2002 when I got it and it works great.
My machine is a Lincoln square wave 175. I got it up in Ohio. My uncle knows a guy that buys the equipment in lots, so I got the machine with everything but a gas bottle, for $800. You got a good deal. This "kick-up box", did you maked it or buy it? Where can you get one?

[RawR/T]

Yeah that's definately a thought. I am trying to do this without the expense of aftermarket TBs, hence the reason for using two OEM TB's. A guy I know did what you are referring to with a Ford engine. I kinda like the look of the old school dual carb thing so I'm going to see what I can do to make it work.

Aftermarket TB's are not always that expensive. I have a 90mm TB that I picked up for like 50 bux a while back. Im may not use it on this build however because I think it will be just to big for my turbo goals.. I agree with the classic look of a dual carb setup, but I like that look more on a rat rod style vehicle. You could also keep the end at the ac compressor closed and put your intake inlet on the side of it. Running a CAI or what ever you want to keep the heat away from the air filter. I would think if you dont put the inlet out of the front and come off a side, you may be able to keep the OE water neck setup and AC in place. I wont be running AC on my setup so I have a little more leway, and im going to use a -16 AN weld on bung to a custom bottom plate for the water neck. Then AN fittings to route the upper rad hose over to a Megan Race Rad that is all aluminum and a lot thicker than OEM so im hoping it will cool a bit better too. With a set of 2 12" puller fans I picked up for 30ea (still have same deal available if anyone is interested) I am going to be doing a bit of fabrication with this so it should be fun.

[Daktaspt]

As for the CFM issue, you could use smaller TB's maybe off a V6 or restrict the flow with some air filter/cold air intake tuning. Motorcycles did that for years. Used a air box to limit air flow.

I would want both TB synchronized though in either application.

[grapejuice1998]

You got a good deal. This "kick-up box", did you maked it or buy it? Where can you get one?

My Uncle scored it for me along with the welder. It's a dedicated piece, designed to multiply the voltage. I'll look and see if it has a manufacturer/model number and I'll also take a picture of it if you like.

[98Dak408]

My Uncle scored it for me along with the welder. It's a dedicated piece, designed to multiply the voltage. I'll look and see if it has a manufacturer/model number and I'll also take a picture of it if you like.
Yeah that would be great if you could. Thanks!

[98Dak408]

Picked up some aluminum T6061 .75" and .875" solid round stock in order to fab some bosses for the mounting bolts. I'll try to get this done over the weekend as well as mill holes for the injector bungs.

[Intense RT]

Looks like some work there for ya. Will be nice when you get done I'm sure.

[98Dak408]

Machined the injector bung holes at a 12-degree angle. Also machined relief’s for the manifold bolt bosses. Arrow in last pic shows one boss for mock-up. I will make them longer than necessary, and once welded on, I will machine them down to height and drill the holes. I've also got to make a fixture like the wood blocks to get the injector bungs at the right position so the person welding doesn't have to think about anything but welding. I can't afford a TIG welding machine right now so I'll have to farm the welding out.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P2210038.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P2210042.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P22100452.jpg

[Intense RT]

As usual, nice work. How did you keep the drill from walking with that angle piece where the bolt goes through? Mill a flat, spot drill, then use a drill bit?

[98Dak408]

As usual, nice work. How did you keep the drill from walking with that angle piece where the bolt goes through? Mill a flat, spot drill, then use a drill bit?That's how I was going to do it. However, with both the injector bungs and bolt bosses, I found my center and plunged it with a closed center end mill.

[Intense RT]

That's how I was going to do it. However, with both the injector bungs and bolt bosses, I found my center and plunged it with a closed center end mill.Hey, that'll work too.

[ddrango]

Great work as usual Richard...wow!

[98Dak408]

Great work as usual Richard...wow!Thanks Russ. I'll try to keep plugging away at it and get it finished.

[98Dak408]

Cut the plenum down. I didn't worry about the leveling the platform since I'm not concerned with carburetor floats. It doesn't matter with a TB and it also equalizes the distance to the runners front-to-back. It’s about 7/8" taller than the 2-bbl M1 now.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P2160016.jpg
Unmodified Plenum
http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P2230003.jpg
Modified Plenum

[98Dak408]

Just finished the adapter plates for the 2-bbl throttle bodies. I have the option of using 4-bbl TBs also but the 2-bbl will more than suffice. Now I have to cut lengths of solid aluminum round stock for the manifold bolt bosses and get this sucker welded.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P3050009.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/p30500112.jpg

[Adobedude]

Just finished the adapter plates for the 2-bbl throttle bodies. I have the option of using 4-bbl TBs also but the 2-bbl will more than suffice. Now I have to cut lengths of solid aluminum round stock for the manifold bolt bosses and get this sucker welded.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P3050009.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/p30500112.jpg

Damn...I'm scraping off carpet, and you're reinventing the wheel...Nice job!

[bfranzel]

i like what you have done so far. great job. pride got to love it!

[98Dak408]

Damn...I'm scraping off carpet, and you're reinventing the wheel...Nice job!

i like what you have done so far. great job. pride got to love it! Thanks guys!

Might be time for a cam upgrade. :D

[ddrango]

Pretty nuts Richard! A lot of props to you!

[Pete102580]

Yeah that would be great if you could. Thanks!

i think alan is talking about a step-up transformer.... if you know what kinda specs you're looking for, pick one out from here and i'll look up my price (i work for a distributor) and pass it along:

http://www.solahd.com/products/transformers/Index.htm

pete

[Five9Dak]

Looking good!

[grapejuice1998]

i think alan is talking about a step-up transformer.... if you know what kinda specs you're looking for, pick one out from here and i'll look up my price (i work for a distributor) and pass it along:

http://www.solahd.com/products/transformers/Index.htm

pete

That's pretty much the same, just a newer version.

I forgot to take the pics, but I did look and couldn't find a manufacturer or a p/n. It's probably just as well. Mine's probably full of PCB's.

[98Dak408]

i think alan is talking about a step-up transformer.... if you know what kinda specs you're looking for, pick one out from here and i'll look up my price (i work for a distributor) and pass it along:

http://www.solahd.com/products/transformers/Index.htm

peteThanks Pete! I appreciate your help. I'll read up on this.

That's pretty much the same, just a newer version.

I forgot to take the pics, but I did look and couldn't find a manufacturer or a p/n. It's probably just as well. Mine's probably full of PCB's.
Today 12:48 PM Thanks just the same.

[98Dak408]

Pretty nuts Richard! A lot of props to you!

Looking good! Thanks! Slowly getting there. :)

[Special Ed's R/T - Yaaaay]

are you doing progressive linkage, or having them both work equally ?

[98Dak408]

are you doing progressive linkage, or having them both work equally ?


I intend on a linkage that allows for 1:1 and progressive so it can be tuned for what works best.

[Special Ed's R/T - Yaaaay]

I intend on a linkage that allows for 1:1 and progressive so it can be tuned for what works best.

I'd imagine that a 2 TB tip-in would be hell for the PCM to manage. But then again, running on one, most of the time, doesn't seem like it would allow for even air flow to all cylinders. I'm really interested to see how you work that out. Good luck with it. :biggthumpup:

[98Dak408]

I'd imagine that a 2 TB tip-in would be hell for the PCM to manage. But then again, running on one, most of the time, doesn't seem like it would allow for even air flow to all cylinders. I'm really interested to see how you work that out. Good luck with it. Thanks!

In regard to air flow, some of the Chevy EFI intakes have one throttle body at the front of the manifold and it appears to function well. I also recently met a Ford guy who modified a dual quad tunnel ram for EFI. He fabricated a ram log with the one throttle body at the front and it runs well. F&B has a six-pack TB set up that runs primarily off one TB with a progressive linkage. So I think I have a fair chance of success with mine. It's a matter of setting it up properly and being able to adjust and tune it. I have an SCT tune so that end of things can be adjusted.

[wyotech_cuda440]

In regard to air flow, some of the Chevy EFI intakes have one throttle body at the front of the manifold and it appears to function well. I also recently met a Ford guy who modified a dual quad tunnel ram for EFI. He fabricated a ram log with the one throttle body at the front and it runs well. F&B has a six-pack TB set up that runs primarily off one TB with a progressive linkage. So I think I have a fair chance of success with mine. It's a matter of setting it up properly and being able to adjust and tune it. I have an SCT tune so that end of things can be adjusted.

I completely agree. My Cuda's 6 pack runs off the center carb, and the outboard carbs are vacuum operated. Plus, when you are at low-load and part throttle, the incoming air has plenty of time to work it's way to the far end of the manifold. When you stomp on it, they both open fully so you don't have to worry about an uneven air distribution. I have a friend with a Henry J that has a small block chevy with dual four barrels on a tunnel ram. He runs a progressive linkage without any issues

[98Dak408]

I just produced two 50mm throttle bodies for a couple of guys. Just had to set ‘em on the intake for a visual. :D

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/p31900042.jpg

[BluRT00]

All its missing is a old school Hilborn style scoop. :biggthumpup:

[98Dak408]

All its missing is a old school Hilborn style scoop. :biggthumpup:LOL. Yeah. Too bad it won't fit.

[BluRT00]

LOL. Yeah. Too bad it won't fit.

Could always fab up a bug catcher like the ones in Mad Max... LOL

[98Dak408]

Could always fab up a bug catcher like the ones in Mad Max... LOL There ya go! LOL.

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/25866001madmax_car.jpg

[ghostrt03]

it looks great man....now post up some dyno numbers

[98Dak408]

it looks great man....now post up some dyno numbersHey thanks! I've got to finish it first. Been busy with other priorities lately but will get back to it.

[Rtspeeddemon]

I'd like to see Dyno numbers in comparison to a single TB with an M1 intake assuming similar CFM flow in both trials. Without the comparison you can't base any improvements just theories.

[98Dak408]

I'd like to see Dyno numbers in comparison to a single TB with an M1 intake assuming similar CFM flow in both trials. Without the comparison you can't base any improvements just theories.

Yes that would be nice. Don’t know if the budget will allow that type of testing (to start buying different intakes, larger billet throttle bodies, multiple dyno runs, etc.) for something I’m doing for fun. Even if the budget allowed such testing you could always argue that the temperature and humidity were difference…or the testing wasn’t done on the same day…etc.

The following is an interesting article where testing was done on a 440 comparing a single carb intake with a dual quad tunnel ram intake. The tunnel ram was the top performer throughout the rpm range from top to bottom:

“Moreover, check out those torque figures. The 440 twisted out 513.3 lbs.-ft. at 3,000 rpm, by far the best low-end output of the inductions tested. The tunnel-ram shelled out 30 more lbs.-ft. than the 4150 and 37.5 lbs.-ft. more than the Dominator at the lowest rpm tested (which, by the way, was as low as the dyno would pull the engine down). Up top, the tunnel-ram outpowered the single 4150 by 66 horses and beat the Dominator setup by 20.4 horses as well, making it the power champ across the entire power curve.”

http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/techarticles/engine/mopp_0109_440_head_buildup_dyno_test/dyno_test_numbers.html

Yes that test is a carburetor on a 440…and is not the same as throttle bodies on a 408. Although in theory ( :) ), I think there is a fair chance my setup may perform well. Again, this is for fun, and I may just have to go with a seat of the pants feel, maybe a dyno pull, and perhaps a couple of runs at the track just to see what it will do. I’ll cross that bridge when I come to it.

[Rtspeeddemon]

Ya unfortauntely comparing a 440 to a 408 is like an apple to a coconut.

As for the dyno being different each day that also is irrelevant as a dyno is SAE corrected for temp and humidity etc.

[98Dak408]

Ya unfortauntely comparing a 440 to a 408 is like an apple to a coconut.

As for the dyno being different each day that also is irrelevant as a dyno is SAE corrected for temp and humidity etc. Like I said, every point can be argued. I'm doing this for fun. :D

[ScojoDak]

All its missing is a old school Hilborn style scoop.

Like this?

http://www.jegs.com/images/photos/900/925/925-7221.jpg

[Rtspeeddemon]

Like I said, every point can be argued. I'm doing this for fun. :D

I know man good job trying something different.

[98Dak408]

Quote:
Originally Posted by BluRT00
All its missing is a old school Hilborn style scoop.

Like this?Yeah that would be pretty cool.

[Intense RT]

With a tunnel ram and a carb a positive plus compared to a single carb/single plane intake is fuel distribution. We don't have to worry about that being fuel injected.

Looking forward to results!

Would be nice to see a comparison between M1 4 bbl or even 2 bbl to see a difference maybe.

[98Dak408]

With a tunnel ram and a carb a positive plus compared to a single carb/single plane intake is fuel distribution. We don't have to worry about that being fuel injected.True. My main intent was a way to provide for a less restricted intake, with higher and balanced air flow, that I could use modified OEM throttle bodies on to save on cost. And for something fun to play with.

Looking forward to results!

Would be nice to see a comparison between M1 4 bbl or even 2 bbl to see a difference maybe.I might put the M1 4-bbl on with a 53.6mm TB and get a dyno run. Then get a dyno with the tunnel ram. Wouldn't be a perfect test but might show some differences.

[badinfluence]

I'm late to the party,but your work looks great and I'm very interested in how everything works out!

[98Dak408]

I'm late to the party,but your work looks great and I'm very interested in how everything works out!Hey Thanks! A few days ago I media blasted the intake and related pieces with glass shot and took it to Dunn's Welding in Southfield, MI to get everything welded up. Hope to have it back some time next week.

[98Dak408]

The intake is now welded. Next I have to fly cut the ram log since the heat from welding warped it a bit, mill the bolt bosses down, drill the holes, and clean up the ports a bit before I proceed with anything else.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P4280004.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P4280046.jpg

[Sick 660r]

cant believe I missed this thread. Very nice work!!!

[Intense RT]

Cool. Are you done yet? Are you done yet?:D

[98Dak408]

cant believe I missed this thread. Very nice work!!!
Thanks man!

[98Dak408]

Cool. Are you done yet? Are you done yet?
LOL! I wish.

I will say I'm closer to the end than the beginning. :D

[ghostrt03]

Its looking good man...keep it coming...i know you see the light at the end of the tunnel:biggthumpup:

[98Dak408]

...i know you see the light at the end of the tunnel
No pun intended? :jester:

[kota360]

Rick, I can't wait to see this thing completed. It will be wild. You've done excellent work.
When you get this thing fired up, send the dyno info to Dave Hughes and tell him, "This is how you design a proper intake for our engines". It's awsome.

[Warrior Poet]

Rick, I can't wait to see this thing completed. It will be wild. You've done excellent work.
When you get this thing fired up, send the dyno info to Dave Hughes and tell him, "This is how you design a proper intake for our engines". It's awsome.
Can I have it:biggthumpup:

[98Dak408]

Rick, I can't wait to see this thing completed. It will be wild. You've done excellent work.
When you get this thing fired up, send the dyno info to Dave Hughes and tell him, "This is how you design a proper intake for our engines". It's awsome.
Thanks Man!

Can I have it :biggthumpup:Hey good luck with that one. :D

[jmaack727]

When you get this thing fired up, send the dyno info to Dave Hughes and tell him, "This is how you design a proper intake for our engines". It's awsome.

:jester:

[ScojoDak]

Dude, as a former machinist and manufacturing engineer, whether it works or not, I appreciate the effort you're putting into this project. Therefore..... *lol*

http://www.fastmoving.co.za/news-archive/supplier-news/POTY-Desktop-v2.jpg

[Pete102580]

i find myself devising ways to use that manifold with my vortech... maybe weld shut an off the shelf air cleaner housing & make a hole for the discharge tube.. hmmmmmmm

[98Dak408]

i find myself devising ways to use that manifold with my vortech... maybe weld shut an off the shelf air cleaner housing & make a hole for the discharge tube.. hmmmmmmm A conventional dual quad oval air cleaner probably won't fit because the rear throttle body is close to the fire wall. I'll probably have to fabricate one or possibly use something like these Spectre air hats:

http://www.jegs.com/i/Spectre/865/9849/10002/-1

http://www.jegs.com/i/Spectre/865/98499/10002/-1

[Pete102580]

good point. i would probably cut the back for clearance, as long as the thing was getting welded & sealed anyway.

pete

[98Dak408]

good point. i would probably cut the back for clearance, as long as the thing was getting welded & sealed anyway.

pete Yeah I guess it wouldn't be a problem if the back of the air cleaner was cut and welded, if that's what you are referring to.

[98Dak408]

I Machined the A/C-alternator bracket for the water neck clearance as well as the A/C compressor. It looks like I’m going to have to take a little more off the A/C compressor. However, I can’t take off much more. I might have to off-set the water neck a tad but I can’t go very far with that either.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P5210008.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P5210011.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P5210010.jpg

It appears that I’m going to have to mount the throttle bodies backwards or the throttle cable, TV cable, and cruise control cable bracket will interfere with the throttle body throttle plate brackets. Or I might have to fabricate new throttle plate brackets to keep the throttle bodies pointing foreword.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P5210016.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P5210015.jpg

I’ll have to give this further thought.

[bfranzel]

so far so good! i liketheway it looks! and well i think its going to work just fine!

[kota360]

Now that is going to be a work of art.
Keep up the excellent work Rick, and don't give up. That package will be "Bad A$$" when complete.

[98Dak408]

so far so good! i liketheway it looks! and well i think its going to work just fine!

Now that is going to be a work of art.
Keep up the excellent work Rick, and don't give up. That package will be "Bad A$$" when complete. Hey thanks guys! So far I'm happy with the progression.

[ADakotaRTGuy]

If you need another one.

http://lancaster.craigslist.org/pts/1733691597.html

[Adobedude]

If you need another one.

http://lancaster.craigslist.org/pts/1733691597.html

That's it, I'm going carbed, even if only one works.....LOL

[98Dak408]

If you need another one.

http://lancaster.craigslist.org/pts/1733691597.htmlThat's a decent price; they're around $400 new. I was lucky enough to find mine on Craigslist for $140.

I might consider doing another one once I get this sucker finished, tuned in, and working well.

Note: One thing that would concern me with this Craigslist ad for the intake is the seller says it was sandblasted. You really want to glassbead aluminum for welding because other media like sand or oxide can contaminate the aluminum intake metal and be detrimental to the welding process.

[98Dak408]

I think I know how I'm going to do the throttle linkage.. I want to make sure I have a positive engagement along with adjustability. I am going to run the throttle bodies 180-degrees or backwards so the throttle shaft linkage on the driver's side does not interfere with the cable bracket on the passenger's side. A shaft will cross the plenum. The passenger’s side will have the stock cable bracket attached. For the driver’s side I will fabricate throttle shaft brackets for each throttle body along with linkage using small ¼” rod ends to tie it into the cross shaft. The cross shaft will use 7/16” rod ends as bearings and to hold it in place. The cross shaft has a shoulder machined into the passenger's side to position the rod end. I machined a collar to lock it in place on the other side of the rod end. The driver's side rod end will not require a collar because the shaft is locked in place on the passenger's side. Now I have to fabricate a bracket to hold the rod ends in place as well as the cable bracket on the passenger’s side. Once that is done I will fabricate the throttle body shaft brackets and linkage.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P6080042.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/p60800472.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P6080048.jpg

[grapejuice1998]

Whoever TIG'd that does nice work. :biggthumpup:

[Adobedude]

Too fucking cool....

Awesome skills....:hail:

[98Dak408]

Whoever TIG'd that does nice work. :biggthumpup:
Yes they do. That was done by Dunns Welding in Southfield, MI. A plug for their business. "When it's Dunn by Dunn it's Dunn!" :D

[98Dak408]

Too fucking cool....

Awesome skills....:hail:
Thanks man!

Awesome work...

(This is my 2nd post, 1st one is in lala land...Stupid forum.)

:jester:

[BluRT00]

In love with it!

[Five9Dak]

Good idea with the shaft. I think you might be better off with small blocks and double shielded ball bearings though.

I think you are going to eventually develop some slop between the shaft and the inner race of the rod end, or the rod end is eventually going to get trashed in the underhood environent.

The rod ends sure look cool in that application though.

[98Dak408]

Good idea with the shaft. I think you might be better off with small blocks and double shielded ball bearings though.

I think you are going to eventually develop some slop between the shaft and the inner race of the rod end, or the rod end is eventually going to get trashed in the underhood environent.

The rod ends sure look cool in that application though.Rod ends are used quite a bit on multi-carb set ups so I'm not too worried about it. The one rod end is sandwiched between the shoulder and collar and doesn't slip. I have .0005 clearance between the rod and the inner race and when you turn the rod the spherical bearing turns too. If that is going to be a problem it would be a problem with the pillow blocks and sealed bearings too. I researched the pillow blocks and sealed bearings and that gets pretty expensive. I could machine my own pillow blocks but that is a lot of work when a rod end should suffice. The rod end is more adjustable than a pillow block. I like the cleaner look of the rod end too.

[98Dak408]

I modified the stock cable bracket so it will attach securely to the intake, hold the rod end, and allow clearance for the TPS sensor mounted upside down. (The TPS sensor is just a rheostat, and times out perfectly with the throttle shaft 180-degrees around, so I don’t see why it won’t work in that position.) I will add another collar to the driver’s side of the cross shaft so that it bears against the rod end bearing, to help assure that it turns with the rotation of the cross shaft, so it doesn’t wear the softer aluminum (as was a concern of Five9Dak). Once I mock up and fabricate the remaining parts of the linkage, and know it is going to work, I’ll clean up the steel pieces and paint them so they don’t look so rough. I'm also trying to set it up so the top plenum section, linkage, and throttle bodies are a module seperate from the lower portion of the intake, injectors, and fuel rails. That way, I can more easily remove the top section to work on the distributor or whatever.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P6190023.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P6190024.jpg

[Five9Dak]

Looks like you are making good progress. I can't wait to hear how it performs.

[98Dak408]

The cable brackets are pretty much done on the passenger’s side. Now to work on the throttle body linkage and throttle shaft brackets on the driver’s side.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P6200025.jpg

[98Dak408]

I modified the stock cable bracket so it will attach securely to the intake, hold the rod end, and allow clearance for the TPS sensor mounted upside down. (The TPS sensor is just a rheostat, and times out perfectly with the throttle shaft 180-degrees around, so I don’t see why it won’t work in that position.)

FWIW: The 4.7 TB uses the same TPS sensor and it is mounted 180-degrees from the position of the 5.2/5.9 TPS sensor or upside down. I don't think there will be any problem with it in that position on my set-up.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/Photo1a.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P6200025.jpg

[98Dak408]

Just finished mocking up the driver’s side linkage. The linkage arms adjust as a turn buckle for infinite adjustment. The Rolette looking wheel allows the ability to try a number of arrangements and settings. However, this 1:1 setup is quite simple and functions very smoothly. I will try this set up first and see if there are any issues.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P7130034.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P7130037.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P7130041.jpg

[BluRT00]

I am in love! Makes me want to build a high compression stroker and slap this bad boy on it.

[98Dak408]

I’ve modified the linkage a bit on the driver’s side. Due to the path (arc) the rod end takes on the wheel when accelerating, the front throttle body begins to open faster than the rear throttle body and approaches WOT at a slower rate than the rear throttle body. The rear throttle body opens at a slower rate but approaches WOT at a faster rate than the front throttle body. However, both throttle bodies reach WOT and close at the same time but accelerate/decelerate at different rates. The reason being is as the wheel turns, the front TB is immediately pulled open but the rear throttle body loses foreword (horizontal) travel as the arc of the wheel swings down vertically, thereby losing movement along the horizontal plane. The difference isn’t much, but I want it to be precise.

In order to resolve the progression of each throttle body so that it is in sync with one another, I have changed the driver’s side linkage a bit. I just have to iron out a few clearance issues…and that part will be good to go.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P7150043.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P7150044.jpg

[rattler360]

awesome

[98Dak408]

Finally changed the “wheel of fortune” for something a little more refined. Now to finish the water neck.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P7310003.jpg

[BluRT00]

I really hope this takes off for you and people buy this setup. Would be cool to see these setups on trucks. I know Bruce's bad ass 6 pack is out there but not many have them. Hopefully yours will be cheap enough for a regular joe to afford.

[brandofamily]

I'm not trying to be ignorant. but what is this set up going to do for your engine? More power? Better response? Thanks for feeding my ignorance.

[G-Man]

I'm not trying to be ignorant. but what is this set up going to do for your engine? More power? Better response? Thanks for feeding my ignorance.

Just my 2¢
More Power ? YES
Better Response ? Maybe
One of a Kind, Cool Factor? Oh Yea

[98Dak408]

I'm not trying to be ignorant. but what is this set up going to do for your engine? More power? Better response? Thanks for feeding my ignorance.


Quote:
Originally Posted by brandofamily
I'm not trying to be ignorant. but what is this set up going to do for your engine? More power? Better response? Thanks for feeding my ignorance.

Just my 2¢
More Power ? YES
Better Response ? Maybe
One of a Kind, Cool Factor? Oh Yea

Yes I'm hoping to improve power. Going to see how it runs with the current cam. Then at some point install a healthier cam and perhaps a higher stall convertor as well. I like the old school look as well. :)

[98Dak408]

I really hope this takes off for you and people buy this setup. Would be cool to see these setups on trucks. I know Bruce's bad ass 6 pack is out there but not many have them. Hopefully yours will be cheap enough for a regular joe to afford.Thanks! Not sure how this will pan out. Been fun though. Trying to get it together so I can see how it runs.

[98Dak408]

Fabricated an offset water neck that clears the intake and A/C compressor. Not pretty but functional.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/Photo005.jpg

[grapejuice1998]

How is that not pretty? I think it's pretty badass!

I gotta admit, I wasn't too keen on the dual 2bbl thing to start with, but you have turned the entire project into a work of art. :biggthumpup:

[Nolan]

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/Photo005.jpg

Oh great, now we have a water neck with Peyronie's Disease!



Nolan

[98Dak408]

Oh great, now we have a water neck with Peyronie's Disease! LOL. Yeah I probably should have taken the pic with it on the engine.

[Five9Dak]

You didn't happen to have a setup piece for that flange that ended up good as well did you?

[98Dak408]

You didn't happen to have a setup piece for that flange that ended up good as well did you?I cut, drilled, and machined the flange out of steel flat stock. I originally took a suppossed cast steel big block water neck and cut the end off. But as I was cutting it was very apparent is wasn't steel. I should have checked with a magnet first but the sales guy told me it was steel and it seemed to weigh as much as steel so I figured I'd give it a shot. I used that blank to trace the shape of the flange onto the dyed blue steel flat stock. The curved piece of tube I bent on my mandrel tube bender, and the smaller hose end I machined on a lathe. Then I welded it all together.

[98Dak408]

How is that not pretty? I think it's pretty badass!

I gotta admit, I wasn't too keen on the dual 2bbl thing to start with, but you have turned the entire project into a work of art. Thanks!

[Intense RT]

Keep it up. Looks good to me because I don't like flashy engine components for the most part. I'd love to see some rwhp dyno numbers out of sheer curiosity comparing to the typical setup we run. EFI makes it interesting.

[98Dak408]

Keep it up. Looks good to me because I don't like flashy engine components for the most part. I'd love to see some rwhp dyno numbers out of sheer curiosity comparing to the typical setup we run. EFI makes it interesting.Thanks! I do appreciate a well detailed engine but I too am more into form and function. (I wouldn't mind a well detailed engine but it is not in the budget at the moment and I am probably too lazy to keep it bright and shiny anyway :) ) If the set up feels good I'll probably hit a dyno to see where I'm at.

[98Dak408]

I cut an IAC motor open to see WTF. (The motor windings got caught in the blade and kind of unraveled. LOL. )

Using the IAC pintle I fabricated a block-off plate for the front throttle body IAC port.

Since I want this thing running by the Woodward Dream Cruise in Michigan I’m going to use two small air cleaners until I have time to possibly do something custom.

What’s left?

1. Perhaps make a block-off plate in place of the front TB TPS sensor.
2. Make some support brackets for the Alt/AC bracket to the intake.
3. Paint all brackets.
4. Fabricate fuel rail mounts.
5. Plumb fuel rails.
6. Port match intake runners.
7. Assemble.
8. Fire it up.
9. Fine tune things.
10. Have fun and try to avoid the cops.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8020010.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8040011.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8040018.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8040016.jpg

[kota360]

Richard as I said to you on the phone, this is an absolute work of art.
I can't wait to see/hear about how this runs, with this set-up.

[Intense RT]

I cut an IAC motor open to see WTF. (The motor windings got caught in the blade and kind of unraveled. LOL. )

Using the IAC pintle I fabricated a block-off plate for the front throttle body IAC port.

Since I want this thing running by the Woodward Dream Cruise in Michigan I’m going to use two small air cleaners until I have time to possibly do something custom.

What’s left?

1. Perhaps make a block-off plate in place of the front TB TPS sensor.
2. Make some support brackets for the Alt/AC bracket to the intake.
3. Paint all brackets.
4. Fabricate fuel rail mounts.
5. Plumb fuel rails.
6. Port match intake runners.
7. Assemble.
8. Fire it up.
9. Fine tune things.
10. Have fun and try to avoid the cops.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8020010.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8040011.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8040018.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8040016.jpgDamn, wish you lived down the road, lol. Hell of a fabricator and ingenuity. Make that m'fukr work.:biggthumpup:

[98Dak408]

Richard as I said to you on the phone, this is an absolute work of art.
I can't wait to see/hear about how this runs, with this set-up.Thanks Ken! Good talkin' to ya.

[98Dak408]

Damn, wish you lived down the road, lol. Hell of a fabricator and ingenuity. Make that m'fukr work.I'm starting to get excited now. :D

Just remembered I still have to hook up a vacuum source and a valve cover breather system. I don't wan't to be blowing oil from the PCV into the intake.

[grapejuice1998]

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8040016.jpg

Like they say in the Old Country...FUCKIN A+!! :biggthumpup:

[kota360]

If you have the baffles in the valve covers, just run a couple of K&N breathers on each side. It will be good like that.

[98Dak408]

If you have the baffles in the valve covers, just run a couple of K&N breathers on each side. It will be good like that.Yes I've been contemplating that too.

[98Dak408]

Cleaned up the casting flash and port matched:

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8150020.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8150023.jpg

Made a vacuum block/terminal to run all vac stuff off of such as power brakes, EVAP, and MAP. Using an 8AN line to the block. With vacuum the bigger the line the better.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8190033.jpg

Capped off the TPS of the front TB.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8190034.jpg

Fab’d bracket for Alt/AC mount.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8190035.jpg

Everything hooked up and ready to roll.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8190028.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8190029.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8190030.jpg

Fired it up at 10:00pm Thursday night. Didn’t run long because of the neighbors. Set the IAC counts to about 30 and the TPS to .72V. So-far-so-good. Running very well. The tip-in off idle is fairly sensitive and somewhat abrupt. Great for the strip but maybe a little too sensitive for everyday driving for some. I guess it depends upon what you like. A progressive linkage would be less sensitive. There is no bog or loss of low end torque. In fact it feels stronger everywhere. Moving up through the rpm range is much improved. Pulls harder. I do believe the engine is now getting all the cfm it can consume and with no ill effects. I’m running two 52mm TB’s on it.

Also using two valve cover breathers in place of the PCV. Placed at the front to reduce the possibility of oil pushing through upon acceleration.

[WhiteRT]

That is a work of art my friend.....I dont say that very often to dakota owners but that is probably one of the cleanest, most unique installs I have seen in all my years in this community.

Todd

[tcuillier]

That is a work of art my friend.....I dont say that very often to dakota owners but that is probably one of the cleanest, most unique installs I have seen in all my years in this community.

Todd

X2 --- well done for sure!

Tom

[Adobedude]

Man....Too cool.

Nice job!!!:hail::hail:

[kota360]

Hey Richard congratulations on getting your truck up and running. Are you heading for Woodward today? I'm looking forward to getting over to your shop and see this thing in person. Completed and running, that is a true work of mechanical and engineering art.

[98Dak408]

Thanks guys! I am very happy with it. I'm going to hang out with the R/T guys at the Teknicolor parking lot in Pontiac for a while.

[Adobedude]

Thanks guys! I am very happy with it. I'm going to hang out with the R/T guys at the Teknicolor parking lot in Pontiac for a while.

Did you bead blast the mainifold..?

[BluRT00]

I am in love. :biggthumpup:

[ScojoDak]

3 words....... Un-Freakin-Believable!

Hands down the best engineering for 5.2/5.9 motors since F&B throttle bodies. And that's been quite a long time. Great work!

[Intense RT]

Cleaned up the casting flash and port matched:

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8150020.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8150023.jpg

Made a vacuum block/terminal to run all vac stuff off of such as power brakes, EVAP, and MAP. Using an 8AN line to the block. With vacuum the bigger the line the better.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8190033.jpg

Capped off the TPS of the front TB.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8190034.jpg

Fab’d bracket for Alt/AC mount.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8190035.jpg

Everything hooked up and ready to roll.

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8190028.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8190029.jpg

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab68/98Dak408/P8190030.jpg

Fired it up at 10:00pm Thursday night. Didn’t run long because of the neighbors. Set the IAC counts to about 30 and the TPS to .72V. So-far-so-good. Running very well. The tip-in off idle is fairly sensitive and somewhat abrupt. Great for the strip but maybe a little too sensitive for everyday driving for some. I guess it depends upon what you like. A progressive linkage would be less sensitive. There is no bog or loss of low end torque. In fact it feels stronger everywhere. Moving up through the rpm range is much improved. Pulls harder. I do believe the engine is now getting all the cfm it can consume and with no ill effects. I’m running two 52mm TB’s on it.

Also using one valve cover breather for the PCV and one for the EGR. Placed at the front to reduce the possibility of oil pushing through upon acceleration.You definitely did great work and should be proud of it. It's unique for sure. Now...I wanna see you fab a nice oval air cleaner for it, lol. Congrats man.

[98Dak408]

Did you bead blast the mainifold..?Yes. Glass bead inside and out.

[Adobedude]

Yes. Glass bead inside and out.

Thanks....

[kota360]

So how was Woodward Richard?
I sure wish we could have made it today.
I'm sure that set-up of yours got alot of looks.
How was it to drive?

[mopardude67]

Wow! Way to make a cool idea a reality, great job and cudos your way!:biggthumpup:

[98Dak408]

So how was Woodward Richard?
I sure wish we could have made it today.
I'm sure that set-up of yours got alot of looks.
How was it to drive?Lots of people and cars. However due to the rain not as many as usual. It cleared up after a while. Still lots of fun.

The truck pulls really well from a dead stop up through the rpm range. A very noticeable improvement. Absolutely no bog or low end loss. Very responsive. Feels like there is more everywhere. I am really happy.

The IAT sensor went out on me and gave a trouble code for high voltage. The scanner showed the IAT temp stuck at 100-degrees. I'll try to get another one tomorrow.

[kota360]

You have now proven Dave Hughes theory about his dual plane intake to be better for bottom end and mid range to be a bunch of "bullsh!t". Your set-up shows that these engines just love lots of air and the velocity to pack the cylinders full of it. The tunnel ram, with large plenum and long straight runners, just takes the M-1 two barrel to the extreme and shows how well it can and does work.

[98Dak408]

Played around at the higher rpm range today and the intake really shines up top; it pulls very hard and fast.

The brakes also feel stronger. I suspect the ram log may have something to do with that. Perhaps it is acting as a vacuum reservoir.

[slvr03dakrt]

can you set me one up I'm thinking I want to rock a tunnel ram with 2 4 bbls tb's. I would even cut the stock hood and put aircleaner stacks sticking up out of the hood.

[98Dak408]

can you set me one up I'm thinking I want to rock a tunnel ram with 2 4 bbls tb's. I would even cut the stock hood and put aircleaner stacks sticking up out of the hood.Shoot me an email at richard@hi-potek.com so I can review exactly what you are considering and the steps involved to accomplish it.

[99408kotar/t]

man what an amazing job. i read most of the thread but did i miss a price or if you even gonna try and mass produce these?

[98Dak408]

man what an amazing job. i read most of the thread but did i miss a price or if you even gonna try and mass produce these?Thanks man! Mass production would require a lot of orders to break even of that process. I could produce more but I'm trying to determine what it would cost me to do as efficient as possible. It is a considerable amount of custom work done by hand and non-automated machine.

[Adobedude]

Thanks man! Mass production would require a lot of orders to break even of that process. I could produce more but I'm trying to determine what it would cost me to do as efficient as possible. It is a considerable amount of custom work done by hand and non-automated machine.

It's one of the coolest fab jobs I've seen since I've owned my R/T.

Good job.

:rockwoot:

[grapejuice1998]

No shit. I thought it was silly to start with, but I'm a big fan now.
This guy has SKILLS!! :biggthumpup:

[98Dak408]

Short vid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbkwFjqnzfE

[grapejuice1998]

Short vid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbkwFjqnzfE

Fucking AWESOME! :biggthumpup:

[Adobedude]

Short vid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbkwFjqnzfE

Too friggen cool....NICE job...


:rockwoot::rockwoot::rockwoot:

[badinfluence]

Amazing!!!

[Pete102580]

wow. awesome work!

[kota360]

I have been to Richard's and also been for a ride in his truck. In one word, AWESOME!!!!!!
The man is an excellent fabricator, does perfect work, and is a true all around great guy. The truck runs unbelievable and is extremely streetable with this setup. It would be nice if someday he could make a few more of these, as they would sell like hot cakes.

[tcuillier]

Flat amazing! Well done.

Tom