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Caleditor
06-06-2012, 11:11 PM
I can do it and make it run better. You can use EFILive, HPTuners, TunerCat to tune this PCM. I will need to work something out for the auto guys. I can set this up for 8 individual coils, a 4 coil pack system, or a Distributor and 1 coil.

I can use a 24x or 4x crank input also and a 1x cam

Adobedude
06-06-2012, 11:18 PM
I can do it and make it run better. You can use EFILive, HPTuners, TunerCat to tune this PCM. I will need to work something out for the auto guys. I can set this up for 8 individual coils, a 4 coil pack system, or a Distributor and 1 coil.

I can use a 24x or 4x crank input also and a 1x cam

Can and have done it?

or

Can and working on it?

Caleditor
06-06-2012, 11:33 PM
I have that PCM running several non GEN II engine currently.

If you put a 24x wheel on it then like one from this site it makes it very easy.
http://www.eficonnection.com/eficonnection/Order24xComponents.aspx

As you can see they have one that goes behind the T-Cover, but you can run one between the balancer and the drive belt pulley.

I haven't done a MOPAR, but it would be a very quick project for me.

I have the code mapped out. I could put a PTO on a Vette and make it work like it came from the factory.

RTchas
06-06-2012, 11:47 PM
Keep talkin you've got our attention.

wyotech_cuda440
06-07-2012, 12:38 AM
That would require installing a MAF sensor, right? No more 14" filters, but the closed loop MPG gains might be worth it.

BLKDAK
06-07-2012, 12:41 AM
Here is AJ's website.
http://www.pcmcalibrators.net/index.html
I have been after him about tuning Dak's, hopefully we can encourage him enough to make us some superior tunes to make some serious HP.
I have no doubts that he can tune whatever we throw at him.

Caleditor
06-07-2012, 01:40 AM
That would require installing a MAF sensor, right? No more 14" filters, but the closed loop MPG gains might be worth it.

I can set it up for a MAF or Speed Density

1, 2, or 3 bar operating systems

Adobedude
06-07-2012, 01:44 AM
I feel like were pulling teeth here, grasping for straws...Pissin in the wind..

Got a price....?

BLKDAK
06-07-2012, 02:42 AM
Ok AJ, these folks are real here, this ain't dak-duh, we got money to spend and we want to go fast.
Don't be pulling their chains. Most of run the SCT by Hemifever with unlimited tunes, some of us run MS3 or XFI. We need some tunes no matter what tuner or PCM you got us running.
You knew exactly what Nutter was doing as soon as I mentioned it to you. He's most likely running YOUR patch to run the Hemi.
Let me know if you need some spare PCM's, I got a few in the garage, a MP and a B&G. If you need to analyze them I will send them to you.
A few of us have big cams, high lift and long duration, we want to get the most out of them, but want them to idle correctly and not hang up the idle when getting off the gas, recently a couple members have had high RPM lean issues, obviously not ideal.
We are looking for tuning solutions. I know you have the answers.
I know you do not like Mopars anymore but just look the other way and smile when you watch the youtube videos of these daks smoking those POS lightnings knowing you tuned it.

Adobedude
06-07-2012, 02:47 AM
Ok AJ, these folks are real here, this ain't dak-duh, we got money to spend and we want to go fast.
Don't be pulling their chains. Most of run the SCT by Hemifever with unlimited tunes, some of us run MS3 or XFI. We need some tunes no matter what tuner or PCM you got us running.
You knew exactly what Nutter was doing as soon as I mentioned it to you. He's most likely running YOUR patch to run the Hemi.
Let me know if you need some spare PCM's, I got a few in the garage, a MP and a B&G. If you need to analyze them I will send them to you.
A few of us have big cams, high lift and long duration, we want to get the most out of them, but want them to idle correctly and not hang up the idle when getting off the gas, recently a couple members have had high RPM lean issues, obviously not ideal.
We are looking for tuning solutions. I know you have the answers.
I know you do not like Mopars anymore but just look the other way and smile when you watch the youtube videos of these daks smoking those POS lightnings knowing you tuned it.

Correction...That would be Faster. :biggthumpup:

BLKDAK
06-07-2012, 02:52 AM
Thank you Dave, good point.

RTchas
06-07-2012, 03:04 AM
Ok AJ, these folks are real here, this ain't dak-duh, we got money to spend and we want to go fast.
Don't be pulling their chains. Most of run the SCT by Hemifever with unlimited tunes, some of us run MS3 or XFI. We need some tunes no matter what tuner or PCM you got us running.
You knew exactly what Nutter was doing as soon as I mentioned it to you. He's most likely running YOUR patch to run the Hemi.
Let me know if you need some spare PCM's, I got a few in the garage, a MP and a B&G. If you need to analyze them I will send them to you.
A few of us have big cams, high lift and long duration, we want to get the most out of them, but want them to idle correctly and not hang up the idle when getting off the gas, recently a couple members have had high RPM lean issues, obviously not ideal.
We are looking for tuning solutions. I know you have the answers.
I know you do not like Mopars anymore but just look the other way and smile when you watch the youtube videos of these daks smoking those POS lightnings knowing you tuned it.

Let's not forget us boosted guy's here we have more and more boosted trucks every year on this site:biggthumpup:

KicknAsphlt
06-07-2012, 03:56 AM
I heard a rumor about a GM PCM running a Mopar engine (in a Jeep IIRC)....something about the only real issue was re-pinning the connectors to match the signal I/O of the GM ECU. Never could find anything on it, but this was back about '06/'07.

CNTHOOK
06-07-2012, 05:15 AM
Subscribed

PacManRT
06-07-2012, 11:27 AM
I noticed in the first post you said you'll have to figure something out for the autos. Do you thinks its possible,? Most of us here are still running autos. Also what about obd testing? In md I still have to pass an obd test every 2 years, which is why I chose to go megasquirt as its easily reversable with a jumper harness.

Adobedude
06-07-2012, 11:45 AM
I noticed in the first post you said you'll have to figure something out for the autos. Do you thinks its possible,? Most of us here are still running autos. Also what about obd testing? In md I still have to pass an obd test every 2 years, which is why I chose to go megasquirt as its easily reversable with a jumper harness.

You can still run an auto, just get a manual valve body.

Five9Dak
06-07-2012, 11:54 AM
Why go to a non emissions legal flash based solution with slow datalogging when you could have a full standalone, tuned live with good datalogging that works with the factory harness, sensors and trigger wheels?

JTEC can still run the auto in either case.

Megasquirt can run on the JTEC stuff with no modifications, all stock sensors and stock engine wiring harness, and it's already been done.

krs1r/t
06-07-2012, 12:38 PM
Correction...That would be Faster. :biggthumpup:

this is def not dak-dur!!! yes always striving to be faster!!! tell us what u can do and how!!!:biggthumpup:

99408kotar/t
06-07-2012, 12:52 PM
You have my attention

Sick 660r
06-07-2012, 01:03 PM
Why go to a non emissions legal flash based solution with slow datalogging when you could have a full standalone, tuned live with good datalogging that works with the factory harness, sensors and trigger wheels?

JTEC can still run the auto in either case.

Megasquirt can run on the JTEC stuff with no modifications, all stock sensors and stock engine wiring harness, and it's already been done.

You've been trying to make that point for a long time now. I don't think it's going to get through to anyone.

Five9Dak
06-07-2012, 01:20 PM
Not here at least. I guess it's not expensive enough to be taken seriously? I dunno, the car that won drag week this year used MS3.

Adobedude
06-07-2012, 01:21 PM
You've been trying to make that point for a long time now. I don't think it's going to get through to anyone.

But who is actually doing it...?
Seems like it's just an experiment so far.

Sick 660r
06-07-2012, 02:12 PM
But who is actually doing it...?
Seems like it's just an experiment so far.

Mine runs on MS3X but I haven't had time to tune it. Jason's also runs on MS3X. Mine started on the first try fwiw.

Nobody here runs on a chevy comp but everyone seems interested:jerkit:

Five9Dak
06-07-2012, 02:25 PM
But who is actually doing it...?
Seems like it's just an experiment so far.

There are approximately 5 people running magnum v8s with all stock sensors. None of them really post here about it because it isn't well received. I don't really understand why, but I've more or less given up convincing people here. I drove mine to canada and back, daily driven, autocrossed and drag raced it so far. Then my transmission broke. I probably have about 10k miles on MS total. It was an experiment, now it's an option.

I think ultimately people say they want full control and a good solution, but they aren't willing to try it, and they want somebody else to do it for them.

scatpackdal
06-07-2012, 03:01 PM
I think ultimately people say they want full control and a good solution, but they aren't willing to try it, and they want somebody else to do it for them.

I think this statement is particularly true. Recently I've been more interested in MS as just an "inexpensive" way to mess around with my truck and learn something new. Is there any good comprehensive thread/how-to that documents the entire process in our trucks? I know when it comes down to the specifics of learning the ins and outs of EFI I have a long way to go.

Five9Dak
06-07-2012, 03:16 PM
There is a google document being generated by the racemagnum crew on the magnum specific installs.

Caleditor
06-07-2012, 04:18 PM
I will work up a price with several different crank triggers and with our Dual-Flash PCM also

What is the OmniTuner DUAL-FLASH?

The OmniTuner DUAL-FLASH is a member of the OmniTuner line of products by Digital Inflection Corporation. This device allows you to install two separate flash chips in one Powertrain Control Module. Most GM Generation III applications are supported but when ordering specify which PCM you have so that the DUAL-FLASH has the proper flash chips installed. GM used both 512k and 1 megabyte flash chips in the GEN III PCMs.

http://www.pcmcalibrators.net/uploads/8/1/0/2/8102322/652054414.jpg

The DUAL-FLASH replaces the flash chip that was installed by the factory with two separate OEM flash chips that individually appear to the PCM as a single flash chip when selected. Through the use of a switch of your choice you have the ability to select which one of these flash chips is used by the PCM. You have the ability to switch between flash chips only when the ignition is in the “off” position to prevent accidently switching between flash chips when the car is running.

Possible applications for the DUAL-FLASH include tuning a vehicle for multiple fuels, assuming this tuning is compliant with emission regulations. You can use ethanol based fuels when available and switch back to conventional fuels when desired. Additionally you might choose to tune one flash chip for fuel economy but leave the other flash chip stock. Any tune that you can flash to a stock PCM can be flashed to either one of the flash chips of a DUAL-FLASH enabled PCM.

Caleditor
06-07-2012, 04:24 PM
We can also set up a PCM as a RoadRunner for EFILive or TunerCat real time emulation. We build a few of these every year. The PCM get a USB connection for real timing tuning

PacManRT
06-07-2012, 05:13 PM
Why go to a non emissions legal flash based solution with slow datalogging when you could have a full standalone, tuned live with good datalogging that works with the factory harness, sensors and trigger wheels?

JTEC can still run the auto in either case.

Megasquirt can run on the JTEC stuff with no modifications, all stock sensors and stock engine wiring harness, and it's already been done.

I agree chris, I was just thinking about having a truck that could pass emissions as is, without swapping injectors, map, etc to run through on the factory ecu. Megasquirt will still very likely be my choice. someone had to ask the questions, might as well try to get as many options as we can.

Five9Dak
06-07-2012, 05:30 PM
There is no way this option will pass plug in emissions, it would register as the wrong vehicle. :-/

Figure out how to work your magic on the JTEC, or finish up what SCT neglected- that'd be the ticket for NA/nitrous.

RTchas
06-07-2012, 05:54 PM
Chris where can I buy a plug and play MS harness?:idunno:
And how many Power Adder trucks are putting the smack down on SCT tuned trucks?:idunno: I understand what your saying but I haven't seen the evidence yet to make me run out and buy anything other than SCT:nono: I know your truck has been (was) running on it but N/A 13's don't show me anything. I ran that on a JET chip 10yrs ago:jerkit::jester:

Five9Dak
06-07-2012, 06:22 PM
There are 2-3 turbo trucks on racemagnum. I ran MS with the KB. MS is boost aware, unlike JTEC. My AFR is exactly what I want it to be, everywhere, everytime, in all weather. It doesnt matter if you make 300 or 3000hp, 19lb injectors or 160, the standalone will not be a limiting factor. I suppose people could show you datalogs of their AFR on target? Best of all, if you have compressor that makes quick boost, instead of open loop all the time, you can run close loop WIDEBAND. This means you can cruise target any AFR you want, instead of just 14.7. This means more part throttle torque, much more.

Nobody sells a plug and play harness. DIYautotune makes such a thing for other applications, if there is a market for that, let them know. The hold up will still be the electric over hydrualic clusterfuck of a transmission we have, the easiest solution is a "parallel" install, so JTEC can run everything but the fuel, spark and IAC.

You literally need to tee in 5 wires as inputs to MS, (crank, cam, TPS, IAT, CLT) and the JTEC can stay there unknowing. Then you can "take over" as many outputs as you want. Most people don't even bother with an adapter harness.

Any setup can run a number at the track, or make a dyno pull. That's sweeping the same cells everytime. It's the rest that is hard to get right, and people complain about.

grapejuice1998
06-07-2012, 06:39 PM
The reason I don't listen to the MS3 hype is; you have to prove to me that it's super easy and works twice as good. You can tell me that all day long, but I don't get anything out of that.

If there were people actually using it on a daily basis that could give me some insight on it, I might be willing to switch over. Until then, I will continue to use SCT, even if I have to use e mail tunes, because what other real choices do I have?

Five9Dak
06-07-2012, 06:56 PM
I have no vested interest in selling MS. I wasn't pleased with what was availible, I figured it out, and I shared everything I know. I produced documentation for mod circuits I designed (which arent required for ms3) And I started a magnum specific documentation on google docs. The system literally tunes itself, it doesnt get much easier.

I am a person who used it on a daily basis in two different configurations, and there are more on racemagnum. Go ask them what they think. They are here too, but they don't bother piping up because it is isn't well recieved here.

BryanRT360
06-07-2012, 06:59 PM
I have no vested interest in selling MS. I wasn't pleased with what was availible, I figured it out, and I shared everything I know. The system literally tunes itself, it doesnt get much easier.

I am a person who used it on a daily basis in two different configurations, and there are more on racemagnum. Go ask them what they think. They are here too, but they don't bother piping up because it is isn't well recieved here.

I want! But no monies. One day though ,I can't wait to set my Target A/f.

RTchas
06-07-2012, 07:42 PM
I wouldn't mind being on target too, however like Alan said SHOW ME.. I wasn't a big SCT fan till I saw Jim's turbo truck go 10's:idunno:
I was at PIE soon after and cut my ET by 1sec after that trip. like Dave's sig "Proof is in the Pedal":jerkit:
Are the guys on RM street guys? or just Track Star's?
I want a turn key driver that can be a track star..:D
I know the trans is junk, so be it I will push it to it's limit I like the OD mpg for long hauls no one trick pony here:nana:

How is it MS isn't well received here? Because we all run SCT maybe? If a MS user here went 10's or even 11's with MS and simple mod's we all agree on Blower, Nx , Turbo who would treat then like shit? I for one would be intreged by that fet and if enuff guys tell the tale the tide would turn to MS tuning ..However we haven't seen it? Hell Duner is running a set-up that is outdated and said to never work:idunno: No one treats him like a turd in the punch bowl?

RTchas
06-07-2012, 07:45 PM
Bottom line, Christopher you are going to be the chosen one..Hehe get'r dun! Show us some #'s on MS and the OE KB KIT:finger: Then I will fold up my SCT tent and come to the darkside:hail:

Duner
06-07-2012, 07:48 PM
I wouldn't mind being on target too, however like Alan said SHOW ME.. I wasn't a big SCT fan till I saw Jim's turbo truck go 10's:idunno:
I was at PIE soon after and cut my ET by 1sec after that trip. like Dave's sig "Proof is in the Pedal":jerkit:
Are the guys on RM street guys? or just Track Star's?
I want a turn key driver that can be a track star..:D
I know the trans is junk, so be it I will push it to it's limit I like the OD mpg for long hauls no one trick pony here:nana:

How is it MS isn't well received here? Because we all run SCT maybe? If a MS user here went 10's or even 11's with MS and simple mod's we all agree on Blower, Nx , Turbo who would treat then like shit? I for one would be intreged by that fet and if enuff guys tell the tale the tide would turn to MS tuning ..However we haven't seen it? Hell Duner is running a set-up that is outdated and said to never work:idunno: No one treats him like a turd in the punch bowl?

Hey! I resemble that remark! hahaha

My "old school" FMU setup will be going bye-bye. Just a matter of getting the stuff to make it happen. :D

grapejuice1998
06-07-2012, 07:51 PM
I have no vested interest in selling MS. I wasn't pleased with what was availible, I figured it out, and I shared everything I know. I produced documentation for mod circuits I designed (which arent required for ms3) And I started a magnum specific documentation on google docs. The system literally tunes itself, it doesnt get much easier.

I am a person who used it on a daily basis in two different configurations, and there are more on racemagnum. Go ask them what they think. They are here too, but they don't bother piping up because it is isn't well recieved here.

You keep saying that, but in my mind it would be well received if it wasn't presented as such a pipe dream.

Show me a "kit" so to speak, that will work with my truck and I will use it.

I'm not an electrician, engineer, or tuner.

Five9Dak
06-07-2012, 08:08 PM
Diyautotune.com, buy the ms3, ms3x and associated harness pigtails. Attach five wires to engine harness. Set up sensors, datalog for a bit to verify everything is kosher, wire up injectors, coil iac as you see fit. MS is configurable to work on everything, so you need to do a bit of your own work for every application. Unless a vendor provides a plug and play harness, like DIY does for some applications.

You guys are missing the point if you think running a number is proof enough to get an engine management system. Duner makes an FMU go fast, making a pass is not the be all end all.

As far as my calling, I'm focusing on the blower kit stuff. Not convinving people to go to standalones. I have a full time job and there's only so much time in day. If you want somebody to hold your hand, there are lots of shops capable of installing and tuning MS on your truck.

krs1r/t
06-07-2012, 08:08 PM
i have a "?" how much money do i need to spend to switch from sct to ms? can it be done in a weekend? will i go faster? will it be more streetable?

Five9Dak
06-07-2012, 08:18 PM
Are the guys on RM street guys? or just Track Star's?

I want a turn key driver that can be a track star..:D
I know the trans is junk, so be it I will push it to it's limit I like the OD mpg for long hauls no one trick pony here:nana:

Street and track.

If you want good MPG you need closed loop operation. The MS got 22mpg on my stock longblock with the KB. That was WITHOUT lean cruising. It just held 14.7 with much less deviation, so I could use less throttle angle. On JTEC I can feel the torque ripple from the narrowband trimming as a I watch it on the wideband. I could (but didnt bother yet) lean it out further for even more mileage.

I've said it over and over, for the NA guys and nitrous, I would stick to SCT. In any case where you are forced to go to open loop only tune because of the limitations of JTEC- I would consider a standalone because it doesnt have those limitations. For high boost, I would want more MAP axis resolution than JTEC affords.

Five9Dak
06-07-2012, 08:22 PM
i have a "?" how much money do i need to spend to switch from sct to ms? can it be done in a weekend? will i go faster? will it be more streetable?

Depends which version you want and how much work you want to do. you can literally build the ECU from a pile parts, or buy a used one, or buy a prebuilt one. The prices for the ECU configurations span from ~200 to ~600. Then for wiring it will depend on how much you buy assembled versus source. I would budget at least $50 for wiring supplies.

I have done it in a weekend more than once. Others have as well. It started, idled and drove on the first crank (both 19 and 65lb injectors) using all the baseline stuff, after I entered the information it needed. I went faster than the mopar computer NA, and the KB shit when I had that installed. Depends on how good your tune is now of course. It will be more streetable if you have drivability or manners issues now. If everything is already the way you want it, you of course have no reason to switch. But not all SCT users seem completely satisfied.

Compared the mopar computer, which I used to think was good/OK, the MS is so good I literally have no desire to even start or drive my truck when its running on JTEC. The difference in part throttle torque is astounding. The truck actually feels like it has 360 cubes under the hood now. The torque delivery and throttle response is sharp, the engine sounds and runs "happier" everywhere. The idle is more stable, it doesn't hang, it doesn't carry on. It doesn't do anything I don't tell it to do. There are no idiosyncracies.

I hate to pick on Robby, but I drove his heads/cam/sct truck at nats. We have similar torque converters. His truck is slower than mine, and my motor is stock. Thats the only experience I have with SCT. I couldn't even drive behind him, because his cruising AFR was so rich it was smoking me out.

krs1r/t
06-07-2012, 08:28 PM
well my truck is N/A but it wants to stall when i come to a stop sign! and if i could get the a/f gauge to be more steady while street driving and make it more streetable like have close to the same mannors as a "stockish " truck i think it would be worth the switch! plus i would like to have full control to make changes as i saw it, not have to go threw emails!!! plus i have plans for a boosted 425 making tons of power!!! maybe get used to the MS now on N/A to get the hang of the programming for later??????

RTchas
06-07-2012, 08:30 PM
If it's so great why dont you run it on the neon?:stirringthepot::nana:

Five9Dak
06-07-2012, 08:30 PM
well my truck is N/A but it wants to stall when i come to a stop sign! and if i could get the a/f gauge to be more steady while street driving and make it more streetable like have close to the same mannors as a "stockish " truck i think it would be worth the switch! plus i would like to have full control to make changes as i saw it, not have to go threw emails!!! plus i have plans for a boosted 425 making tons of power!!! maybe get used to the MS now on N/A to get the hang of the programming for later??????




It sounds perfect for you. It would solve all those limitations JTEC has. I would recommend you learn to tune NA before you try boost. It's best to approach one thing at a time.

Five9Dak
06-07-2012, 08:31 PM
If it's so great why dont you run it on the neon?:stirringthepot::nana:

The Neon has an ngc model based boost aware controller with a 3bar map sensor that is completely cracked by diablo. None of those things can be said about the JTEC/SCT combo.

It is one of the nicest calibrated cars I've ever been around, stock and aftermarket tuned. Zero issues what so ever and it runs its ass off.

RTchas
06-07-2012, 08:34 PM
The Neon has an ngc model based boost aware controller with a 3bar map sensor that is completely cracked by diablo. None of those things can be said about the JTEC/SCT combo.

It is one of the nicest calibrated cars I've ever been around, stock and aftermarket tuned. Zero issues what so ever and it runs its ass off.

Timeslip or it's slow:nana:

Five9Dak
06-07-2012, 08:34 PM
I built it for autocross, wanna race?

Its fast enough for a grocery getter, took out a mach1 with drag radials on the highway last week.

PacManRT
06-07-2012, 08:40 PM
For those that asked. I priced everything a few weeks ago. For everything pre-assembled (MS3X, both pre-assembled harnesses, and the necessary modifications for ECU comtrolled boost) I was looking at right around $860. If I cared to assemble the MS3 and harnesses myself I could save about $300.

mtlcafan79
06-07-2012, 08:58 PM
It is one of the nicest calibrated cars I've ever been around, stock and aftermarket tuned. Zero issues what so ever and it runs its ass off.

Is yours running a "canned" tune? I'm trying to convince my roommate to toon his, but he says they ping on standard tunes, need to be dyno tuned, have to be babysat with a wideband all the time, etc. He just wants to drive it to work and home and could care less.

Hahns5.2
06-07-2012, 09:08 PM
The reason I don't listen to the MS3 hype is; you have to prove to me that it's super easy and works twice as good. You can tell me that all day long, but I don't get anything out of that.

If there were people actually using it on a daily basis that could give me some insight on it, I might be willing to switch over. Until then, I will continue to use SCT, even if I have to use e mail tunes, because what other real choices do I have?
I've run it on my truck for 36k daily driven miles :idunno:


Seriously, MS is the way to go.

grapejuice1998
06-07-2012, 09:17 PM
I've run it on my truck for 36k daily driven miles :idunno:


Seriously, MS is the way to go.

Your little :idunno: implies that I should have already known that. lol

It's nice to know that though. Thanks! :biggthumpup:

2k1AmberR/T
06-07-2012, 09:18 PM
I've run it on my truck for 36k daily driven miles :idunno:


Seriously, MS is the way to go.

There you are!

:stirringthepot:

2k1AmberR/T
06-07-2012, 09:19 PM
For those that asked. I priced everything a few weeks ago. For everything pre-assembled (MS3X, both pre-assembled harnesses, and the necessary modifications for ECU comtrolled boost) I was looking at right around $860. If I cared to assemble the MS3 and harnesses myself I could save about $300.

This is about right. I'd consider it ~1000 bucks. You still need the software, a patch harness is a super nice addition to have, other misc. electrical components.

PacManRT
06-07-2012, 09:38 PM
I wish I could find an aem patch harness, they have gone extinct. I'm just going to splice into the harness and try to keep it clean.

2k1AmberR/T
06-07-2012, 09:38 PM
But who is actually doing it...?
Seems like it's just an experiment so far.

The experimentation is over, for you to duplicate what has already successfully been duplicated would be about as difficult as following directions (that are written in English, of course).

Caleditor
06-07-2012, 09:45 PM
It just held 14.7 with much less deviation, so I could use less throttle angle.

Thats funny stuff

I haven't seen 14.7 to 1 fuel in over 19 years and 8 months. How can you find 14.7 to 1 fuel?

Caleditor
06-07-2012, 09:49 PM
Should I start a new thread again about the 0411? You guys are way off topic and I can bash MS if you would like me to point out all the faults.

I can put together a GM PCM to run a MOPAR that will make over 1000 hp and drive like a factory car

RTchas
06-07-2012, 10:03 PM
Should I start a new thread again about the 0411? You guys are way off topic and I can bash MS if you would like me to point out all the faults.

I can put together a GM PCM to run a MOPAR that will make over 1000 hp and drive like a factory car

Sorry for the thread Jack, Your hitting a nerve here we have very little options with even fewer Tuner's willing to help:idunno: so alot of stuff come's out when you make statement's about a new way to make these POS run:biggthumpup: it's all healthy disscusion Im friends with Chris he's a smartass, I mean smart Kid:nana:

Caleditor
06-07-2012, 10:41 PM
Sorry for the thread Jack, Your hitting a nerve here we have very little options with even fewer Tuner's willing to help:idunno: so alot of stuff come's out when you make statement's about a new way to make these POS run:biggthumpup: it's all healthy disscusion Im friends with Chris he's a smartass, I mean smart Kid:nana:

So rip the PCM apart, Pull the memory chip, read it out and then find a disassembler, then figure out the code. If it take you 3 years it take 3 years no big deal.

RTchas
06-07-2012, 10:46 PM
So rip the PCM apart, Pull the memory chip, read it out and then find a disassembler, then figure out the code. If it take you 3 years it take 3 years no big deal.

Huh?:idunno: Thats directed to me? Cause Im lost in the sauce as far as that process go's:jester:

White Turbo
06-07-2012, 11:23 PM
Should I start a new thread again about the 0411? You guys are way off topic and I can bash MS if you would like me to point out all the faults.

I can put together a GM PCM to run a MOPAR that will make over 1000 hp and drive like a factory car

A.J.,

There isn't a thread in this forum that doesn't go off topic in a hurry. That's just the way this place has always been.
Please continue your discussion here and maybe the guys will not interupt.

I'd like to know more about what specifically you can do for our group.

Are you talking specifically about running the new gen hemi's with your PCM, or our old 360's? Or both?

Tell us what advantages your set up has over other types of tuning, such as SCT, and other standalone tuners like MS, Accel DFI, FastXFI, etc. No need to bash the other tuners.... But please do explain the differences between them.

Also, prices for your product and tuning would be nice too.

FlyinRyan
06-08-2012, 01:11 AM
This is interesting. Will be waiting to see what comes of this. I have HPTuners, just haven't really needed to use it.

KicknAsphlt
06-08-2012, 01:26 AM
I've been wanting to roll the truck over to MS for years now....but never could due to emissions (was registered in NV, and they plug-in for codes). Now, CO is running emissions up in the areas that didn't used to....so it's still not viable for me, unless I want to start swapping shit back to be able to run the factory/MP PCM. Thinking about pulling the trigger on MS3 for the supra though...OBD1, so I can get away with it, even with emissions testing. :biggthumpup: :nana:

BLKDAK
06-08-2012, 01:32 AM
Your hitting a nerve here we have very little options with even fewer Tuner's willing to help:idunno: so alot of stuff come's out when you make statement's about a new way to make these POS run:biggthumpup:

Exactly what I stated earlier, so limited tuning options with sooo many 360 Mopars in different configurations whether N/A, N20, turboed, blown, or stroked, yet we have the worst tuning available. I'm not referring to just daks either, millions of rams out there that ppl drive like hot rods b/c they are RWD V8 Dodges.
We were stuck with hypertech, superchips, and now the SCT but it isn't cutting the mustard.

AJ cracked the GM tuning, he can make the patch for our trucks.:rockwoot:

Adobedude
06-08-2012, 01:43 AM
Your hitting a nerve here we have very little options with even fewer Tuner's willing to help:idunno: so alot of stuff come's out when you make statement's about a new way to make these POS run

Exactly what I stated earlier, so limited tuning options with sooo many 360 Mopars in different configurations whether N/A, N20, turboed, blown, or stroked, yet we have the worst tuning available. I'm not referring to just daks either, millions of rams out there that ppl drive like hot rods b/c they are RWD V8 Dodges.
We were stuck with hypertech, superchips, and now the SCT but it isn't cutting the mustard.

AJ cracked the GM tuning, he can make the patch for our trucks.:rockwoot:

SWEET...But how much dolla? When?

Don't hang the PAH carrot in front of a bunch ET chasing addicts without having answers.... :biggthumpup:

krs1r/t
06-08-2012, 01:58 AM
SWEET...But how much dolla? When?

Don't hang the PAH carrot in front of a bunch ET chasing addicts without having answers.... :biggthumpup:

What he said!!!

krs1r/t
06-08-2012, 02:03 AM
I can put together a GM PCM to run a MOPAR that will make over 1000 hp and drive like a factory car
What percent is in it to allow for correction (weather)!

User
06-08-2012, 02:10 AM
I wish I could find an aem patch harness, they have gone extinct. I'm just going to splice into the harness and try to keep it clean.

I have one, and I'm pulling it apart to fix the pins. Some of the pins got pushed back, easy fix.

Axiom
06-08-2012, 02:27 AM
I wish I could find an aem patch harness, they have gone extinct. I'm just going to splice into the harness and try to keep it clean.

Isn't this it? http://www.aemelectronics.com/ecu-patch-extension-harness-30-2981-827

Lists the 03 - 04 Dakota 5.9L. Should work with the earlier years I would think?

Sick 660r
06-08-2012, 10:13 AM
Should I start a new thread again about the 0411? You guys are way off topic and I can bash MS if you would like me to point out all the faults.
I can put together a GM PCM to run a MOPAR that will make over 1000 hp and drive like a factory car

Please continue. I'm curious about all the faults.

Five9Dak
06-08-2012, 11:18 AM
Thats funny stuff

I haven't seen 14.7 to 1 fuel in over 19 years and 8 months. How can you find 14.7 to 1 fuel?

I don't understand.

wyotech_cuda440
06-08-2012, 01:31 PM
I don't understand.

I think he's talking about the ethanol content dropping the lambda below 14.7:1, since pure gasoline is not too common anymore.

Even with ethanol in the gas, 14.7 is slightly leaner than stoich, but it's a pretty rich target afr for cruise and you still got good mileage, that's the whole point you made.

Quicksrt
06-08-2012, 07:05 PM
I'm interested in hearing more too. I've been having a lot of lean problems in the low rpms since installing my blower and sct.

PacManRT
06-08-2012, 08:08 PM
A.J.,

There isn't a thread in this forum that doesn't go off topic in a hurry. That's just the way this place has always been.
Please continue your discussion here and maybe the guys will not interupt.

I'd like to know more about what specifically you can do for our group.

Are you talking specifically about running the new gen hemi's with your PCM, or our old 360's? Or both?

Tell us what advantages your set up has over other types of tuning, such as SCT, and other standalone tuners like MS, Accel DFI, FastXFI, etc. No need to bash the other tuners.... But please do explain the differences between them.

Also, prices for your product and tuning would be nice too.


What he said/\

PacManRT
06-08-2012, 08:09 PM
Isn't this it? http://www.aemelectronics.com/ecu-patch-extension-harness-30-2981-827

Lists the 03 - 04 Dakota 5.9L. Should work with the earlier years I would think?

Yes thats it... Its discontinued though :(

PacManRT
06-08-2012, 08:09 PM
I have one, and I'm pulling it apart to fix the pins. Some of the pins got pushed back, easy fix.

Do you want to sell it? I'll buy it as is, even if I have to fix pins and such!

Caleditor
06-08-2012, 10:04 PM
A.J.,

There isn't a thread in this forum that doesn't go off topic in a hurry. That's just the way this place has always been.
Please continue your discussion here and maybe the guys will not interupt.

I'd like to know more about what specifically you can do for our group.

Are you talking specifically about running the new gen hemi's with your PCM, or our old 360's? Or both?

Tell us what advantages your set up has over other types of tuning, such as SCT, and other standalone tuners like MS, Accel DFI, FastXFI, etc. No need to bash the other tuners.... But please do explain the differences between them.

Also, prices for your product and tuning would be nice too.
I can make an RX7 run on an 0411

Caleditor
06-08-2012, 10:08 PM
I don't understand.

I take a fuel sample when I dyno tune a car. If I find the Ethanol % at 10% then I set the stoich at 14.1 and then tune the car. If I find it at 5% then I set the stoich for 5% and tune the car. If you don't you could chase your tail and or just never get it perfect

Duner
06-08-2012, 10:32 PM
I take a fuel sample when I dyno tune a car. If I find the Ethanol % at 10% then I set the stoich at 14.1 and then tune the car. If I find it at 5% then I set the stoich for 5% and tune the car. If you don't you could chase your tail and or just never get it perfect

Around here it varies from 10% to 15% depending upon time of year.... but the octane level of the fuel is always suspect.

dakfink
06-09-2012, 12:44 AM
I can make an RX7 run on an 0411

LOL!! You can make anything run on those computers.

The Chevy world uses the crap out of them for all kinds of Mods and Engine swaps. They can be used for un-godly boost applications as well.

Only question I have and that no one has gone un-answered including SCT, is Transmission Control!!!

I know the Automatic version of the 0411 is used to control the 4l60E transmissions.

Our 46re transmissions are really a lot simpler NOT sure why everyone acts like they are some kind of VooDoo. The only thing electronic about them is the Convertor Lock-Up and OverDrive engage. Other than that they are the same as a 727. Only 2 electronic valves in the transmission.

I know the Diesel Crowd has a standalone just for the 48re transmission BUT I haven't been able to find out how programmable it is.

If you could address that you would be steps ahead of most.

FYI: AEM used to have patch cable available for ours as well as Viper PCMs. The PCMs externally are the same.

Might be a way to consider making a PnP application.

Caleditor
06-09-2012, 12:59 AM
LOL!! You can make anything run on those computers.

The Chevy world uses the crap out of them for all kinds of Mods and Engine swaps. They can be used for un-godly boost applications as well.

Only question I have and that no one has gone un-answered including SCT, is Transmission Control!!!

I know the Automatic version of the 0411 is used to control the 4l60E transmissions.

Our 46re transmissions are really a lot simpler NOT sure why everyone acts like they are some kind of VooDoo. The only thing electronic about them is the Convertor Lock-Up and OverDrive engage. Other than that they are the same as a 727. Only 2 electronic valves in the transmission.

I know the Diesel Crowd has a standalone just for the 48re transmission BUT I haven't been able to find out how programmable it is.

If you could address that you would be steps ahead of most.

FYI: AEM used to have patch cable available for ours as well as Viper PCMs. The PCMs externally are the same.

Might be a way to consider making a PnP application.

I need to look over all of the trans electroincs for all years. I have the old MOPAR training booklets, but I need to dig them out. I just tossed a 5 to 6" thick book out 3 weeks ago.

I see that the 2001 or so uses a PCS to control line pressure, but it looks to have a govenor yet. Is this correct?

dakfink
06-09-2012, 01:38 AM
I need to look over all of the trans electroincs for all years. I have the old MOPAR training booklets, but I need to dig them out. I just tossed a 5 to 6" thick book out 3 weeks ago.

I see that the 2001 or so uses a PCS to control line pressure, but it looks to have a govenor yet. Is this correct?

I believe so.

I haven't gotten too deep in them in years and my 2 Daks are 99's.

One I scrapped the trans for a Powerglide for racing. (Actually still have the trans in the Garage)

The other has been sitting in the garage since I bought it a few years back.

White Turbo
06-09-2012, 03:23 AM
I can make an RX7 run on an 0411

Thank you for that insight.

I feel SO much more informed now.

Take care.

Adobedude
06-09-2012, 03:27 AM
Thank you for that insight.

I feel SO much more informed now.

Take care.

What's an RX7...?

dakfink
06-09-2012, 03:35 AM
What's an RX7...?

Normally I would have to ask are you serious!!!?? BUT with you I know you probably are! LOL!!!

Mazda RX7, Famous for their Rotary Motors. NO PISTONS Or RODS. Damn things Had 2 Rotors, Less than 2.0liters and could be made to make 700+hp and spin to 12,0000rpms.

First 2 Gens were ugly as Sin. The Last Gen looked like a Mini-Vette.

G-Man
06-09-2012, 03:39 AM
I need to look over all of the trans electroincs for all years. I have the old MOPAR training booklets, but I need to dig them out. I just tossed a 5 to 6" thick book out 3 weeks ago.

I see that the 2001 or so uses a PCS to control line pressure, but it looks to have a govenor yet. Is this correct?

The 46RE has an Electonic Govenor.
G-Man

KicknAsphlt
06-09-2012, 03:59 AM
I know the Diesel Crowd has a standalone just for the 48re transmission BUT I haven't been able to find out how programmable it is.


You talking about the ATS unit? I still don't understand how they can use that and fool the PCM to keep it happy.

wyotech_cuda440
06-09-2012, 04:04 AM
What's an RX7...?

Just a lil jap car with a tiny motor.

Its only 1.3 litres :jester:.........









Don't line up next to one.... You've been warned.
xKLhJWPLMpw

Sick 660r
06-09-2012, 05:42 AM
Please continue. I'm curious about all the faults.

I wasn't being sarcastic.......

dakfink
06-09-2012, 08:26 AM
You talking about the ATS unit? I still don't understand how they can use that and fool the PCM to keep it happy.

Me either BUT they do?!

Five9Dak
06-09-2012, 11:18 AM
LOL!! You can make anything run on those computers.

The Chevy world uses the crap out of them for all kinds of Mods and Engine swaps. They can be used for un-godly boost applications as well.

Only question I have and that no one has gone un-answered including SCT, is Transmission Control!!!

I know the Automatic version of the 0411 is used to control the 4l60E transmissions.

Our 46re transmissions are really a lot simpler NOT sure why everyone acts like they are some kind of VooDoo. The only thing electronic about them is the Convertor Lock-Up and OverDrive engage. Other than that they are the same as a 727. Only 2 electronic valves in the transmission.

I know the Diesel Crowd has a standalone just for the 48re transmission BUT I haven't been able to find out how programmable it is.


They are not that simple. The electro over hydrualic governor pressure to replace the manual governor for 1-2-3 shifting is not as easy to control as aconventional, newer electronic transmission. You need to do a closed loop pressure control on target governor pressure which is related to speed.

The 48re controller should work on the 46re I think.

Just do a 727 or 518 if you need OD, both with full manual valvebodies. I'm done with the 4Xre nonesense.

Adobedude
06-09-2012, 12:09 PM
I know, Friend had one, it was a screamer...

My point is...I don't care. :idunno:

Caleditor
06-09-2012, 12:12 PM
I was hoping that the PCS system would run the MOPAR trans, but I guess not. You could use that setup or the 0411 to run the trans. If the PCS cxan run it I would think that the 0411 would. I also see that the 0411 supports an Trasmission Control Module (TCM).

http://www.powertraincontrolsolutions.com/simpleshift.php

Caleditor
06-09-2012, 12:27 PM
This is how a 4L60E works -- this is like the TH350 with OD

Transmission Component and System Description

The mechanical components of the 4L60-E are as follows:


A torque converter with an electronically controlled capacity clutch (ECCC)


This transmission is equipped with an ECCC. The pressure plate does not fully lock to the torque converter cover. Instead, the pressure plate maintains a small amount of slippage, about 20 RPM, in SECOND, THIRD, and FOURTH gears, depending on the vehicle application. ECCC was developed to reduce the possibility of noise, vibration, or chuggle caused by TCC apply. Typical apply speeds are 49–52 km/h (30–32 mph) in THIRD gear and 65–73 km/h (40–45 mph) in FOURTH gear. Full lockup is available at highway speeds on some applications.


Torque converter assembly

Servo assembly and 2–4 band assembly

Reverse input clutch and housing

Overrun clutch

Forward clutch

3–4 clutch

Forward sprag clutch assembly

Lo and reverse roller clutch assembly

Lo and reverse clutch assembly

Two planetary gear sets: Input and Reaction

Oil pump assembly

Control valve body assembly



The electrical components of the 4L60-E are as follows:


1–2 and 2–3 shift solenoid valves

3–2 shift solenoid valve assembly

Transmission pressure control (PC) solenoid

Torque converter clutch (TCC) solenoid valve

TCC pulse width modulation (PWM) solenoid valve

Automatic transmission fluid pressure (TFP) manual valve position switch

Automatic transmission fluid temperature (TFT) sensor

Vehicle speed sensor assembly

Caleditor
06-09-2012, 12:28 PM
more on the 4L60E

Electronic Component Description

1–2 and 2–3 Shift Solenoid Valves

The 1–2 and 2–3 shift solenoid valves (also called A and B solenoids) are identical devices that control the movement of the 1–2 and 2–3 shift valves. The 3–4 shift valve is not directly controlled by a shift solenoid. The solenoids are normally-open exhaust valves that work in 4 combinations to shift the transmission into different gears.

The powertrain control module (PCM) energizes each solenoid by grounding the solenoid through an internal quad driver. This sends current through the coil winding in the solenoid and moves the internal plunger out of the exhaust position. When ON, the solenoid redirects fluid to move a shift valve.

Important: The manual valve hydraulically can override the shift solenoids. Only in D4 do the shift solenoid states totally determine what gear the transmission is in. In the other manual valve positions, the transmission shifts hydraulically and the shift solenoid states CATCH UP when the throttle position and the vehicle speed fall into the correct ranges.

The PCM-controlled shift solenoids eliminate the need for TV and governor pressures to control shift valve operation.



3–2 Shift Solenoid Valve Assembly

The 3–2 shift solenoid valve assembly is a normally-closed, 3-port, ON/OFF device that is used in order to improve the 3–2 downshift. The solenoid regulates the release of the 3–4 clutch and the 2–4 band apply.

Transmission Pressure Control Solenoid

The transmission pressure control solenoid is an electronic pressure regulator that controls pressure based on the current flow through its coil winding. The magnetic field produced by the coil moves the solenoid's internal valve which varies pressure to the pressure regulator valve.

The PCM controls the pressure control solenoid by commanding current between 0.1 and 1.1 amps. This changes the duty cycle of the solenoid, which can range between 5 percent and 95 percent (typically less than 60 percent). High amperage (1.1 amps) corresponds to minimum line pressure, and low amperage (0.1 amp) corresponds to maximum line pressure (if the solenoid loses power, the transmission defaults to maximum line pressure).

The PCM commands the line pressure values, using inputs such as engine speed and throttle position sensor voltage.

The pressure control solenoid takes the place of the throttle valve or the vacuum modulator that was used on past model transmissions.


Torque Converter Clutch Solenoid Valve

The torque converter clutch (TCC) solenoid valve is a normally-open exhaust valve that is used to control torque converter clutch apply and release. When grounded (energized) by the powertrain control module (PCM), the TCC solenoid valve stops converter signal oil from exhausting. This causes converter signal oil pressure to increase and move the TCC solenoid valve into the apply position.


Torque Converter Clutch Pulse Width Modulation Solenoid Valve

The torque converter clutch pulse width modulation solenoid valve controls the fluid acting on the converter clutch valve. The converter clutch valve controls the torque converter clutch (TCC) apply and release. This solenoid is attached to the control valve body assembly within the transmission. The TCC PWM solenoid valve provides a smooth engagement of the torque converter clutch by operating during a duty cycle percent of ON time.



Transmission Fluid Pressure (TFP) Manual Valve Position Switch

Important: Seven valid combinations and two invalid combinations are available from the TFP manual valve position switch. Refer to the Transmission Fluid Pressure Manual Valve Position Switch Logic table for valid/invalid combinations for range signal circuits A, B and C.

The transmission fluid pressure (TFP) manual valve position switch consists of five pressure switches (two normally-closed and three normally-open) on the control valve body that sense whether fluid pressure is present in five different valve body passages. The combination of switches that are open and closed is used by the PCM in order to determine the actual manual valve position. The TFP manual valve position switch, however, cannot distinguish between PARK and NEUTRAL because the monitored valve body pressures are identical in both cases.

The switches are wired to provide three signal lines that are monitored by the PCM. These signals are used to help control line pressure, torque converter clutch apply and shift solenoid valve operation. Voltage at each of the signal lines is either zero or twelve volts.

In order to monitor the TFP manual valve position switch operation, the PCM compares the actual voltage combination of the switches to a TFP combination table stored in its memory.

The TFP manual valve position switch signal voltage can be measured from each pin-to-ground and compared to the combination table. On the automatic transmission (AT) wiring harness assembly, pin N is signal A, pin R is signal B, and pin P is signal C. With the AT wiring harness assembly connected and the engine running, a voltage measurement of these three lines will indicate a high reading (near 12 volts) when a circuit is open, and a low reading (zero volts) when the circuit is switched to ground.

The transmission fluid temperature (TFT) sensor is part of the TFP manual valve position switch assembly.



Vehicle Speed Sensor Assembly

The vehicle speed sensor (VSS) assembly provides vehicle speed information to the PCM. The VSS assembly is a permanent magnet (PM) generator. The PM generator produces a pulsing AC voltage as rotor teeth on the transmission output shaft pass through the sensor's magnetic field. The AC voltage level and the number of pulses increase as the speed of the vehicle increases. Output voltage varies with speed from a minimum of 0.5 volts at 100 RPM to more than 100 volts at 8,000 RPM. The PCM converts the pulsing voltage to vehicle speed. The PCM uses the vehicle speed signal to determine shift timing and TCC scheduling.



Automatic Transmission Fluid Temperature Sensor

The automatic transmission fluid temperature (TFT) sensor is part of the automatic transmission fluid pressure (TFP) manual valve position switch. The TFT sensor is a resistor, or thermistor, which changes value based on temperature. The sensor has a negative-temperature coefficient. This means that as the temperature increases, the resistance decreases and as the temperature decreases, the resistance increases.

The PCM supplies a 5-volt reference signal to the TFT sensor and measures the voltage drop in the circuit. When the transmission fluid is cold, the sensor resistance is high and the PCM detects high signal voltage. As the fluid temperature warms to a normal operating temperature, the resistance becomes less and the signal voltage decreases. Refer to TFT Sensor Specifications for a complete comparison of sensor resistance, temperature and signal voltage.

The PCM uses the TFT sensor information to control shift quality and TCC application.



Transmission Range Switch
Note -- Camaro's do not use this switch. They use a P/N switch to tell if it is in gear


The transmission range (TR) switch is part of the park/neutral position (PNP) and backup lamp switch assembly, which is externally mounted on the transmission manual shaft. The TR switch contains four internal switches that indicate the transmission gear range selector lever position. The PCM supplies ignition voltage to each switch circuit. As the gear range selector lever is moved, the state of each switch may change, causing the circuit to open or close. An open circuit or switch indicates a high voltage signal. A closed circuit or switch indicates a low voltage signal. The PCM detects the selected gear range by deciphering the combination of the voltage signals. The PCM compares the actual voltage combination of the switch signals to a TR switch combination chart stored in memory.

Caleditor
06-09-2012, 12:32 PM
This is the big trans. It would be the TH400 with OD

Transmission Component and System Description

The mechanical components of this unit are as follows:


A torque converter with a torque converter clutch (TCC)

A gear type oil pump

Five multiple disk clutches

Two band assemblies

Three planetary gear sets

One sprag clutch

Two roller clutches

A control valve body assembly


The electrical components of this unit are as follows:


Two shift solenoid valves, 1-2 and 2-3

A torque converter clutch (TCC) solenoid valve

A transmission pressure control (PC) solenoid valve

An automatic transmission fluid temperature (TFT) sensor

An automatic transmission fluid pressure (TFP) manual valve position switch assembly

An output speed sensor (OSS)

An input speed sensor (ISS)

Caleditor
06-09-2012, 12:38 PM
Electronic Component Description

Torque Converter Clutch Solenoid Valve

The PCM energizes the torque converter clutch pulse width modulated (TCC PWM) solenoid valve, which is located on the transmission valve body. The TCC PWM solenoid valve acts on the TCC apply valve in order to control the torque converter clutch application.

The TCC PWM solenoid valve is pulse width modulated by the PCM. This means that the PCM pulses the solenoid so that the hydraulic pressure against the torque converter clutch modulates. This modulated pressure allows the TCC to slip slightly, thus keeping the TCC balanced just at the point of engagement.

One diagnostic code is associated with the TCC PWM solenoid valve Code P1860, TCC solenoid circuit – electrical, detects a fault in the TCC circuit. While Code P1860 is set, both fourth gear in hot mode and the TCC are inhibited. Shift adapts do not update and the MIL illuminates. Recovery can occur on the next ignition cycle.

Transmission Pressure Control Solenoid Valve – Force Motor

The pressure control (PC) solenoid valve is attached to the valve body. The valve controls line pressure by moving a pressure regulator valve against spring pressure. The PC solenoid valve takes the place of the throttle valve or the vacuum modulator, which was used on past model transmissions.

The PCM varies line pressure based on engine load. Engine load is calculated from various inputs, especially the TP sensor switch. Line pressure is actually varied by changing the amperage applied to the PC solenoid valve from 0 amps, high pressure, to 1.1 amps, low pressure. The PC solenoid valve current is periodically pulsed in order to prevent contamination from sticking the pressure regulator valve.

One diagnostic code is associated with the PC solenoid valve. Code P0748 sets when the PCM detects a difference of 0.16 amp or more between the amperage commanded and actual amperage. While the code is set, the PC solenoid valve turns OFF. Recovery can occur after the next ignition cycle. Code P0748 does not sense a hydraulic problem such as a stuck valve.

1-2 Shift Solenoid Valve

The 1-2 shift solenoid (SS) valve is a normally open exhaust valve that is attached to the valve body. The PCM controls the solenoid by grounding the solenoid through an internal quad driver. The 1-2 SS valve is ON in FIRST and FOURTH gear. When commanded ON, the 1-2 SS valve redirects fluid to act on the 1-2 shift valve.

There are two PCM related diagnostic trouble codes (DTCs) associated with the 1-2 SS valve: P0751 and P0753.

The PCM monitors the 1-2 SS circuit for an open or short to ground condition. If the PCM detects an open or short to ground condition, then DTC P0753 sets. If the PCM detects an incorrect gear ratio, then DTC P0751 sets. When DTC P0753 or P0751 sets, the PCM commands maximum line pressure, freezes shift adapts from being updated, and inhibits 3-2 downshifts.

2-3 Shift Solenoid Valve

The 2-3 shift solenoid (SS) valve is a normally open exhaust valve that is attached to the valve body. The PCM controls the solenoid by grounding the solenoid through an internal quad driver. The 2-3 SS valve is ON in THIRD and FOURTH gear. When commanded ON, the 2-3 SS valve redirects fluid to act on the 2-3 shift valve.

There are two PCM related diagnostic trouble codes (DTCs) associated with the 2-3 SS valve: P0756 and P0758.

The PCM monitors the 2-3 SS circuit for an open or short to ground condition. If the PCM detects an open or short to ground condition, then DTC P0758 sets. If the PCM detects an incorrect gear ratio, then DTC P0756 sets. When DTC P0758 or P0756 sets, the PCM commands maximum line pressure, freezes shift adapts from being updated, and inhibits 3-2 downshifts.

Automatic Transmission Fluid Pressure Manual Valve Position Switch Assembly

The automatic transmission fluid pressure (TFP) manual valve position switch assembly is a gear range sensing device used by the PCM in order to sense which gear range has been selected by the vehicle operator. The TFP manual valve position switch assembly is located on the valve body, and consists of five pressure switches combined into one unit. The PCM applies system voltage to the TFP manual valve position switch assembly on three separate wires. These three circuits are either grounded or open, depending on which gear range has been selected, and on which combination of the five switches gave pressure applied to them.

When the vehicle is in PARK, with the key ON and the engine OFF, the normal state of the TFP manual valve position switch assembly will be DRIVE 2. When the key is ON and the engine is running, the normal state of the TFP manual valve position switch assembly is in PARK/NEUTRAL.

There are two possible combinations of the switches within the pressure switch manifold that do not represent an actual gear range. If the PCM detects either of these combinations, then a diagnostic trouble code (DTC) sets.

The PCM TFP DTC P1810 sets when the TFP switch indicates the following:


An illegal gear range

DRIVE4, DRIVE2 or REVERSE position before and after start-up

PARK/NEUTRAL with a ratio greater than 1.05

REVERSE with ratio indicating outside of REVERSE

DRIVE4, DRIVE3, DRIVE2 or DRIVE1 with ratio indicating REVERSE


While DTC P1810 is present, the PCM assumes DRIVE4 for shift pattern, sets line pressure to maximum, freezes shift adapts, and forces TCC ON with 4th gear commanded.


Automatic Transmission Input Shaft Speed, Output Shaft Speed Sensors

Both of the automatic transmission input shaft speed (AT ISS) and the automatic transmission output shaft speed (AT OSS) sensors are magnetic induction sensors. The input and the output sensors are accessible from the left hand side of the transmission. The AT ISS sensor is located just forward of center and the AT OSS sensor is located near the rear. A voltage signal is induced in the AT ISS sensor by serrations, which are cut in the outside diameter of the forward clutch housing. Voltage is induced in the output sensor by gear teeth, which are pressed on the outside diameter of the rear carrier assembly.


The PCM uses speed information from these sensors in order to determine the following:


Whether the engine is running

Vehicle speed

Calculation of the gear ratio

Calculation of TCC slip

Calculation of turbine speed


Code P0502 and P0503 set if a fault exists in the AT OSS sensor circuit, and the PCM calculates a default value using the AT ISS sensor values. As long as the fault remains, and the code is set, the PCM also commands maximum line pressure, freeze shift adapts, and the MIL illuminates. If the fault is removed, normal operation resumes after the next ignition cycle.

Automatic Transmission Fluid Temperature Sensor Assembly

The automatic transmission fluid temperature (TFT) sensor assembly is a thermistor which is mounted in the wiring harness assembly. Low transmission temperature produces high resistance, while high temperature produces low resistance. The PCM supplies a 5-volt signal to the TFT sensor assembly through an internal resistor. Then the PCM measures the voltage drop in the circuit. Voltage is high when the transmission is cold and low when the transmission is hot.

The PCM uses the TFT sensor assembly in order to regulate torque converter clutch apply, as well as shift quality.

DTCs P0711, P0712 and P0713 indicate a fault in the TFT Sensor Assembly circuit. After the vehicle has been started, transmission temperature should rise steadily and stabilize between 90–115ฐC (194–239ฐF), depending on load. All three DTCs causes the PCM to use a default value of 140ฐC (284ฐF), thus reacting as if the transmission were hot in either case. When DTCs P0711, P0712 or P0713 are set, the PCM freezes the shift adapts from being updated, and the MIL illuminates. Some driveability symptoms will be noticed, especially when cold.

Transmission Range Switch

The transmission range (TR) switch is part of the park/neutral position (PNP) and backup lamp switch assembly, which is externally mounted on the transmission manual shaft. The TR switch contains four internal switches that indicate the transmission gear range selector lever position. The PCM supplies ignition voltage to each switch circuit. As the gear range selector lever is moved, the state of each switch may change, causing the circuit to open or close. An open circuit or switch indicates a high voltage signal. A closed circuit or switch indicates a low voltage signal. The PCM detects the selected gear range by deciphering the combination of the voltage signals. The PCM compares the actual voltage combination of the switch signals to a TR switch combination chart stored in memory.

Caleditor
06-09-2012, 12:44 PM
In the red I can do without

The electrical components of the 4L60-E are as follows:


1–2 and 2–3 shift solenoid valves

3–2 shift solenoid valve assembly

Transmission pressure control (PC) solenoid

Torque converter clutch (TCC) solenoid valve

TCC pulse width modulation (PWM) solenoid valve

Automatic transmission fluid pressure (TFP) manual valve position switch

Automatic transmission fluid temperature (TFT) sensor

Vehicle speed sensor assembly


The electrical components of the 4L80-E are as follows:


Two shift solenoid valves, 1-2 and 2-3

A torque converter clutch (TCC) solenoid valve

A transmission pressure control (PC) solenoid valve

An automatic transmission fluid temperature (TFT) sensor

An automatic transmission fluid pressure (TFP) manual valve position switch assembly

An output speed sensor (OSS)

An input speed sensor (ISS)

I would need a Transmission Range Switch of some type.

I need to see if I can make the PC soleniod circuit work your trans

Five9Dak
06-09-2012, 01:08 PM
It may be worthwhile to note that PATC markets a "gm solenoid valve conversion kit." That might make using the GM computer more capitable electrically.

KicknAsphlt
06-09-2012, 11:52 PM
Me either BUT they do?!

IIRC, when I talked to them about it, it was the same principle as when Kerry (SY RC down in Texas) did his manual swap, which was jumper a couple pins to fool the PCM into thinking it's in neutral...but also IIRC, I thought he had issues with that and taking it above 4k????

skunkxracing
07-07-2012, 05:46 PM
So is this idea dead?
I really didn't gather any info from the OP that says this IS going to work without adding further complexity to the system.

Caleditor
07-08-2012, 08:21 PM
I had 4 2012 F-150's to convert to CNG before the 30th of last month, so I was busy with them. My father also got sick and has now passed away. I need a few weeks to get back on track

blackknight
07-08-2012, 09:00 PM
Sorry about your loss!

Caleditor
07-08-2012, 09:09 PM
I am fine with it. My dad has been suffering for too many years. Now my little bro aka 1999BLKDAKRT is really taking it hard

blackknight
07-08-2012, 09:22 PM
Sorry for your loss Brian, it doesnt get easier just have to deal with it day by day, i lost my dad 3yrs ago in texas, i had to drive down 1and a half days, do the services and head back home, never took the time to deal with it, well it hit me hard when i got home, shut down,took almost a yr off of work,i never thought it would be like that, luckily my kids and wife delt with me! Again Sorry for ya'lls loss!

skunkxracing
07-08-2012, 10:23 PM
Very sorry for your loss.

y2krtaf
07-09-2012, 01:40 AM
Sorry for your loss guys

RTchas
07-09-2012, 02:26 AM
Sorry to hear about the Loss of your Father, word's do little to comfort in these time's but just being there for each other is Helpful.

grapejuice1998
07-09-2012, 01:35 PM
IIRC, when I talked to them about it, it was the same principle as when Kerry (SY RC down in Texas) did his manual swap, which was jumper a couple pins to fool the PCM into thinking it's in neutral...but also IIRC, I thought he had issues with that and taking it above 4k????

No, that's not right.

His 2000 has the neutral rev limiter alright, but that's how he received it back from Keisler (his was the Beta truck). He drove it to the Nats that way and gave maybe 50, 4k limited test rides.
Later the next day, Damon Blumenstein got into my FSM and found the wiring diagram for the neutral rev limiter. 1 hour later, he had installed a momentary switch (which had to be depressed during start-up every time), and it would rev to the moon.

KicknAsphlt
07-09-2012, 03:33 PM
Thanks for the correction -- couldn't remember exactly what the deal was.

**Edit** Just thought of something too -- in theory, one could install a momentary switch on the clutch assy to perform the same function, since the natural reaction is usually to push the clutch pedal in before turning the key anyway...though, not sure what that would do to that rev limiter circuit if the switch was pressed while the truck was running. I'm sure there are other ways this could be incorporated as well to 'automate' said switch function. (NC relay, etc.)

Adobedude
06-07-2013, 02:24 PM
This turned out to be "Raw" type thread...Maybe it should just go away.

RTchas
06-07-2013, 03:01 PM
This turned out to be "Raw" type thread...Maybe it should just go away.

RAW ? More like Barry, take your pick on whichever Barry ,they booth promised us the world and then didn't come thru with a dam thing they talked about.

KicknAsphlt
06-07-2013, 05:40 PM
WTF, Zombie thread.... (The Walking Thread...?)

dakfink
06-07-2013, 06:18 PM
Somethings should JUST DIE!!!

6speedrt
06-10-2013, 04:07 AM
RAW ? More like Barry, take your pick on whichever Barry ,they booth promised us the world and then didn't come thru with a dam thing they talked about.

Damn, this is going to be no good having the same name and color truck as him...:jester: